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Loadout: Golem: Optimal Level 4 Missioner, Rubicon Update


Golem: Optimal Level 4 Missioner, Rubicon Update


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Ship fitting - Built on June 12, 2013

Golem, 1,000,000,000 ISK
+ 35 0 -
Small Tractor Beam II
Small Tractor Beam II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Salvager II
Bastion Module I
Sensor Booster II
Large Micro Jump Drive
Pith A-Type Large Shield Booster
Republic Fleet Target Painter
Republic Fleet Target Painter
Republic Fleet Target Painter
Republic Fleet Target Painter
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Ballistic Control System II
Large Warhead Flare Catalyst II
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Ammo
Cargo
Drones
Build Views Tagged as
Rubicon 1.4
28th April 2014
48,538 Long range, Missile Boat, PvE
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[Golem, Golem: Optimal Level 4 Missioner Rubicon Update]
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Ballistic Control System II

Sensor Booster II
Large Micro Jump Drive
Pith A-Type Large Shield Booster
Republic Fleet Target Painter
Republic Fleet Target Painter
Republic Fleet Target Painter
Republic Fleet Target Painter

Small Tractor Beam II
Small Tractor Beam II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Salvager II
Bastion Module I

Large Warhead Flare Catalyst II
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II


You need to upgrade your Flash Player
Version 1 changed on Nov 20, 2013
[Golem, Golem: Optimal Level 4 Missioner Rubicon Update]
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Ballistic Control System II

Sensor Booster II
Large Micro Jump Drive
Pith A-Type Large Shield Booster
Republic Fleet Target Painter
Republic Fleet Target Painter
Republic Fleet Target Painter
Republic Fleet Target Painter

Small Tractor Beam II
Small Tractor Beam II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Salvager II
Bastion Module I

Large Warhead Flare Catalyst II
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II


Positive ratings (35)

  • Adanraen
  • AGUKS
  • allise
  • Ashley Animus
  • Ayndra
  • Barnabas Gollier
  • Boscogn
  • Cal Yamada
  • Celise Katelo ☆.¸¸.•´¯`♥
  • charon jinn
  • diaoseoni
  • dmginc308
  • floppyballs
  • GoodGravy
  • Hajif
  • huskybear
  • Ivan St
  • Katherine Winter
  • Khtarg
  • Lukemia
  • masaliantiikeri
  • Navarrus
  • NIFTYGetAtMe
  • Onirisme
  • Periander
  • Pulag
  • rav386
  • Rhodan1970
  • RockNova
  • Rsgud
  • Seranova Farreach
  • Siliouba
  • sirpugg
  • ThE_AthEiiSt
  • Warde Guildencrantz

Negative ratings (0)

Title Author Date Ratings
Stats assume all skills at V. Use EVEHQ for detailed combat simulations.

This feature is currently in Beta.


Targeting Maximum targets 10
Maximum targeting range 154375 m
Scan resolution 170.63 mm
Sensor strength 14 0 0 0
Size/Movement Max velocity 125
Inertia modifier 0.081
Signature radius 450 m
Cargo capacity 1225 m3
Systems Capacitor capacity 7906.25 GJ
Capacitor recharge time 14 minutes 22 seconds
Powergrid 7095.8 / 10625 MW
CPU 693 / 893.75 tf
Shields Shield capacity 11000
Shield recharge time 28 minutes 24 seconds
Shield resistances 0% 50% 47.5% 40%
Armor Armor hit points 8375
Armor resistances 50% 10% 34.38% 58.75%
Structure Structure hit points 9625
Structure resistances 0% 0% 0% 0%
Drones Drone capacity 75 m3
Drone bandwidth 25 Mbit/sec
Drone control range 0 m
How to fund this loadout with PLEX:

Current estimated total value, ISK: 1,691,124,981
Sell this many PLEX* to fund: 3
Convert this many ETC to PLEX: 2 Purchase ETC here

*You may only sell PLEX for ISK via the CCP Secure Transfer Method
You need to upgrade your Flash Player
Updated for Rubicon:

With the new bastion module, and the shield boost bonus of the Golem, a single shield booster is all the tank you need for level 4 missions.

749 DPS Tank vs Serpentis

190km Max Targeting Range w/Script, 208 Max Missile Flight Distance w/Furies

1038 DPS with Furies and Hobgoblin IIs


Pop your MJD, engage the bastion module and go to town. 4 TPS so you can have 2 of them up and going on your current target and 2 fired up on your next target- Or, if you split your launchers into 2 groups, you can have a pair of TPs going with each group.

If you need other mods depending on your current mission, they are interchangable.

Comments

  • June 12, 2013, 06:57:14 pm

    Commander
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    Reputation: 763
    ThE_AthEiiSt forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. ThE_AthEiiSt forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. ThE_AthEiiSt forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. ThE_AthEiiSt forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. ThE_AthEiiSt forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. ThE_AthEiiSt forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. ThE_AthEiiSt forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. ThE_AthEiiSt forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. ThE_AthEiiSt forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. ThE_AthEiiSt forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. ThE_AthEiiSt forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. ThE_AthEiiSt forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    1100 dps with CRUISE MISSILES? +1
  • June 12, 2013, 08:17:09 pm

    Petty Officer 2nd. Class
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    Reputation: 0
    Shin_Getter might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Shin_Getter might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Shin_Getter might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Shin_Getter might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Shin_Getter might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Shin_Getter might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Shin_Getter might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Shin_Getter might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Shin_Getter might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Shin_Getter might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Shin_Getter might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Shin_Getter might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up.

    The ship might not be a lot better, the economics sure can be due to lowered ammo costs and loots.
  • June 12, 2013, 11:10:13 pm

    Fleet Captain
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    Reputation: 1380
    sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    good fit, good desc, +1
  • June 13, 2013, 03:06:32 am

    Member
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    Reputation: 7
    The Mad Rapper is breaking through obscurity. The Mad Rapper is breaking through obscurity. The Mad Rapper is breaking through obscurity. The Mad Rapper is breaking through obscurity. The Mad Rapper is breaking through obscurity.

    I'll be honest, I don't see the point of this fit. The RNI is what you should be using for max CM DPS. If you want almost as good DPS but with better tank, then you should use the SNI. The Golem is for Torps. There's no point using this with CMs when the RNI is arguably a better CM choice, is cheaper and takes less training. The argument about salvagers/tractors is nonsense as well - any decent Lvl 4 runner either sub-contracts their salvage to Pro-Synergy, or uses a Noctis alt.

    I suspect that CCP will buff Torps soon, they need love. When they do the Golem will be worth using with that weapon system, but as things stand now, there's no way I'd use this over an RNI or SNI.

    I won't -1 this, but I won't +1 it either.
  • June 13, 2013, 03:37:16 am

    Lieutenant Commander
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    Reputation: 1334
    Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    I'll be honest, I don't see the point of this fit. The RNI is what you should be using for max CM DPS. If you want almost as good DPS but with better tank, then you should use the SNI. The Golem is for Torps. There's no point using this with CMs when the RNI is arguably a better CM choice, is cheaper and takes less training. The argument about salvagers/tractors is nonsense as well - any decent Lvl 4 runner either sub-contracts their salvage to Pro-Synergy, or uses a Noctis alt.

    I suspect that CCP will buff Torps soon, they need love. When they do the Golem will be worth using with that weapon system, but as things stand now, there's no way I'd use this over an RNI or SNI.

    I won't -1 this, but I won't +1 it either.

    You do know that ship bonuses and cruise missiles got changed in odyssey right? That makes the Navy Raven and the Golem identical in Cruise DPS, but the Golem will apply it slightly better.
  • June 13, 2013, 05:23:09 am

    Member
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    Reputation: 7
    The Mad Rapper is breaking through obscurity. The Mad Rapper is breaking through obscurity. The Mad Rapper is breaking through obscurity. The Mad Rapper is breaking through obscurity. The Mad Rapper is breaking through obscurity.

    You do know that ship bonuses and cruise missiles got changed in odyssey right? That makes the Navy Raven and the Golem identical in Cruise DPS, but the Golem will apply it slightly better.

    According to EFT, the RNI gets 1144 DPS using T2 CMs with 5 Hobgoblin IIs and Lvl 5 skills. The Golem gets 1094 DPS with the same caveats. The RNI gets a 25% Explosion Radius Reduction bonus and a T2 Flare which the Golem doesn't get and can't have. Assuming both fits use 2 RF TPs, the Golem can't possibly apply it's DPS any where near as well as the RNI because it doesn't have the bonus and it doesn't have the 3rd Rig slot.

    If anything, I'd say the Cruise Golem is closer to the SNI in terms of damage application.
  • June 13, 2013, 11:49:11 am

    Member 5th Class
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    Reputation: 0
    Barnabas Gollier has no influence.

    Hi Ghalyen,

    as I proposed this fit in your CNR threat, I will have to +1 this setup, too.
    My conclusion was the same.  The Golem is the slightly better Cruise ship.

    Again, I would like your opinion about a slightly different fit.
    How about using Navy Launchers, Flare II and Bay Loading Accelerator II Rigs and Faction Missiles?
    Bye Bye Elite Cruisers?

    Mad Rapper: You didn´t consider the Target Painter and Explosion Velocity bonus of the Golem.
  • June 13, 2013, 12:52:03 pm

    Lieutenant Commander
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    Reputation: 1334
    Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    Navy launchers don't get the bonus damage from the cruise missile specialization skill, only the tech 2 ones do, so they will be up to 10% behind the tech 2s.

    Navy missiles are usually 3-4 times the cost of furies, and are really inefficient for missions. With the hammerheads and fury missiles, they usually aren't much of a problem anyways.

  • June 13, 2013, 01:33:15 pm

    Member 5th Class
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    Reputation: 0
    Barnabas Gollier has no influence.

    Navy Launchers have a higher ROF than T2 even without the specialization skill.

    ATM navy missiles are 1.5-4 times the cost of T2. You´re right, they are expensive but with the half ammo bonus we are within the range of ammo costs of the CNR.

    Missile DPS will be 933 with faction missiles and 812 with T1. But with better damage application compared to the 1038 Fury DPS ( or 1016 with specialization skill 4).
    I have no idea if the better damage application is worth the loss of DPS.
  • June 17, 2013, 02:49:43 am

    Member
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    Reputation: 7
    The Mad Rapper is breaking through obscurity. The Mad Rapper is breaking through obscurity. The Mad Rapper is breaking through obscurity. The Mad Rapper is breaking through obscurity. The Mad Rapper is breaking through obscurity.

    Mad Rapper: You didn´t consider the Target Painter and Explosion Velocity bonus of the Golem.


    I've looked again and I did indeed make a mistake. OP please accept my apology.
  • June 17, 2013, 05:19:01 am

    Lieutenant Commander
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    Reputation: 1334
    Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    Mad Rapper: You didn´t consider the Target Painter and Explosion Velocity bonus of the Golem.


    I've looked again and I did indeed make a mistake. OP please accept my apology.

    NP :)

    It is still a very small difference though compared to the CNR-the tank and the salvaging is the main differences. The golem would fare better in epic arcs when you have to fly all over and omni tank a bit- but for regular missions they would perform almost the same.
  • August 17, 2013, 12:57:39 pm

    Member 5th Class
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    Reputation: 1
    Katherine Winter has no influence.

    +1 as I have been using your CNR fit for ages, and this is pretty much a straight import over (even though the CoD kiddie in me prefers the digital camo on the CNR!).
  • August 27, 2013, 12:42:47 pm

    Member 4th Class
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    Reputation: 1
    Phylox has no influence.

    I have a probably noob question, sorry if it's silly!  Why not fit a Heavy Diminishing Power System Drain I, or something similar, in one of your high slots instead of a tractor? 
  • August 27, 2013, 02:41:40 pm

    Lieutenant Commander
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    Reputation: 1334
    Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    Neuts are of no use in PvE- by the time you would cap something out, you could just be shooting him instead. With the range bonus to tractors, 2 of them will help cleanup times too.
  • October 20, 2013, 07:53:32 pm

    Member 5th Class
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    Reputation: 0
    GoodGravy might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. GoodGravy might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. GoodGravy might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. GoodGravy might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. GoodGravy might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up.

    Mad Rapper: You didn´t consider the Target Painter and Explosion Velocity bonus of the Golem.


    I've looked again and I did indeed make a mistake. OP please accept my apology.

       Actually, you were originally correct; everyone else is actually wrong, though they don't know it. For some reason, people like to look at bonuses and dabble in a bit of conjecture without actually looking at the math. The Raven Navy Issue actually applies its damage better than does the Golem, and the Golem only comes very close to matching the RNI when the Marauders skill is trained to level five.
       I know math may be a foreign language to some, but here's how the numbers look--assuming the player has maximum skills on both ships:
    1:) Golem has two tech II rigor rigs, two Republic Fleet Target Painters, and has an effective Fury Cruise Missile explosion radius of ~258.6 and an explosion velocity of 114.2. With one target painter applied to a frigate with a generic base signature of 40, the new signature is 64. 64/258.6 = ~0.2475, or about 24.8% effective damage application. With two target painters applied to a frigate with the same base signature, the new signature is 40*1.6*(1+(0.6*.87))=97.408. 97.408/258.6 = ~0.3767, or about 37.7% effective damage application.
    2.) RNI has two tech II rigor rigs, one tech II flare rig, two Republic Fleet Target Painters, and has an effective Fury Cruise Missile explosion radius of ~193.9 and an explosion velocity of ~109.62. With one target painter applied to a frigate with a generic base signature of 40, the new signature is 56. 56/193.9 = ~0.2888, or about 28.9% effective damage application. With two target painters applied to a frigate with the same base signature, the new signature is 40*1.4*(1+(0.4*.87))= 74.448. 74.448/193.9 = ~ 0.3839, or about 38.4% effective damage application.

       As you can see, the RNI actually has the better base damage application with one or two target painters, and only when comparing two target painters on each will the Golem's very slightly higher explosion velocity very slightly improve damage against a moving target (that is moving sufficiently fast to reduce missile damage). The RNI actually creates wrecks better all around, but the Golem boasts a better tank, better ability to sustain that tank, and the ability to gather and consolidate (or even salvage) wrecks as it makes them. Also note that the Golem only has these stats with the Marauder skill trained at V; before that, the RNI is hands down better at creating wrecks than is the Golem.
       Add to all of this the fact that the Golem costs more, requires more time to train, has far less EHP, moves slower, is far more vulnerable to jamming, and targets much slower than the RNI; and you see that the ship is actually not what it's cracked up to be as a cruise missile platform. This is even further established by the existence of the Noctis to outshine its salvaging ability in many PvE scenarios and the very low amount of tank needed for many PvE situations (missions, I'm especially looking at you).
       
       End note: three target painters make the Golem superior in damage application.
     
       Cheers guys,
    GoodGravy
  • October 21, 2013, 04:10:47 am

    Lieutenant Commander
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    Reputation: 1334
    Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    Why in the hell are you shooting frigates with Cruise missiles???!??!?!1

    Damage is better applied on anything bigger, which is what you should be doing.


    But anyways- wait a month when the ship changes- It will be much better as a MJD/Bastion module fit, most likely with torps again.
  • October 21, 2013, 05:21:08 pm

    Member 5th Class
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    Reputation: 0
    GoodGravy might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. GoodGravy might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. GoodGravy might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. GoodGravy might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. GoodGravy might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up.

    Why in the hell are you shooting frigates with Cruise missiles???!??!?!1

    Damage is better applied on anything bigger, which is what you should be doing.


    But anyways- wait a month when the ship changes- It will be much better as a MJD/Bastion module fit, most likely with torps again.


       Aside from the purpose of my post being to disprove the myth that the Golem is better at applying its damage (when only two target painters are being used) than the RNI - which makes the generic frigate signature used one merely for convenience and to place things in perspective - cruise missiles are actually quite effective at destroying elite frigates when two target painters are being used; in fact, when both missile and drone skills are perfect, cruise missiles still kill faster than light drones by a considerable margin. (I've obviously skipped over describing how effective it can be to split missile launchers into even groups of two to four and shoot two frigates at a time with one target painter applied to each. I've also skipped over being able to shoot MWDing frigates with cruise missiles.)
       As many people who use Golems and RNIs may be aware, light drones aren't all that great without DDA modules relative to cruise missiles on a well-fit ship with a pilot who knows how to use two target painters - even against frigates - and many elite frigates like to murder light drones; so being able to one- to three-shot those elite frigates with cruise missiles is invaluable. (This will be even easier when the Marauder changes come to Tranquility and three target painters will be even easier to fit on a Golem.) Additionally, I often kill all the big things way before my drones can take care of the little things.
       Now, when the Marauder changes come to Tranquility, the Golem will definitely benefit from its RNI-equivalent sensor resolution, slightly improved lock range, bastion mode's electronic warfare immunity, and the reduced target painter cycle time; however, torpedoes will still suck. Keep in mind that MJDs aren't necessary or even all that useful in most PvE applications, whereas an MWD or afterburner is better or easier in many applications.

    End note: the Golem also loses twice the damage output of an RNI to each defender missile used against it.

    Cheers,
    GoodGravy
  • October 22, 2013, 12:19:17 am

    Member 5th Class
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    GoodGravy might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. GoodGravy might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. GoodGravy might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. GoodGravy might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. GoodGravy might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up.

       I also +1-rated this fit and your RNI fit, Ghalyen. I have very similar fits on both my Golem and RNI, excepting that I use two Rigor II on each and have a Flare II on the RNI. People often call me crazy, but a medium shield booster is all that's needed; we agree there. I even use the Gistum A-type to remove the need to pulse the booster.
       It's a good fit, and my completion time in AE4 is about 33 minutes, as well - including the bonus room - which is similar to yours. Oh, you actually have my apology for questioning your flying missile ships; I actually didn't look at who posted the fit when I opened it. This is my first time commenting on a fit here, and the UI elements don't exactly stick out to me.

    Cheers,
    GoodGravy
  • November 20, 2013, 07:11:05 am

    Lieutenant Commander
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    Reputation: 1334
    Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    Updated for Rubicon.
  • November 24, 2013, 12:23:16 pm

    Member 5th Class
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    Sepher has no influence.

    Quote
    If you need other mods depending on your current mission, they are interchangable. For Serpentis missions, I would probably drop 2 TPs for another 2 Sensor Boosters to counter the really annoying damps, ECCM for Guristas, etc.. If you absolutely need more tank, throw on a Shield Boost Amplifier.

    No more electronic warfare in Bastion mode. I'd suggest replacing two TP for Cap Recharger ;)

    Best regards
  • November 24, 2013, 12:35:14 pm

    Lieutenant Commander
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    Reputation: 1334
    Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    Quote
    If you need other mods depending on your current mission, they are interchangable. For Serpentis missions, I would probably drop 2 TPs for another 2 Sensor Boosters to counter the really annoying damps, ECCM for Guristas, etc.. If you absolutely need more tank, throw on a Shield Boost Amplifier.

    No more electronic warfare in Bastion mode. I'd suggest replacing two TP for Cap Recharger ;)

    Best regards

    Nope don't need any more cap- this is plenty. 4 TPs will do more good than cap rechargers

  • November 27, 2013, 10:35:38 pm

    Member 5th Class
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    Reputation: 1
    linkxsc has no influence.

    When it comes down to it, you wanna know the only real argument for Golem vs CNR.

    Does your mission have a gate 30-40km away?
    BAM you want a CNR.

    Is the mission say... Angel Extravaganza, with every gate right on the warpin, with lots of highdps enemies that like to engage you at close range?
    Get a Golem.

    All other arguments are just BS compared to that.

    Damage application? You're wasting your time bothering with this. DON'T PANIC. Just put a couple TPs and a rigor on it and it'll work. If you waste any more time thinking about this, you'll go insane and spend several dozen mil on T2 rigors you don't need, spend the money more wise.

    Tank? Who needs it with the savage DPS Both ships are capable of, real men never have to cycle their boosters.

    Ewar? Not really an argument anymore, used to be the number 1 thing the CNR had over the golem. Now the Golem wins, but Ewar doesnt really matter much if you're good.

    Skill Requirement? Clearly you haven't been playing Eve long enough to be part of this argument.

    Cost? Well the Golem does cost a bit more to buy initially. But CNRs eat faction/T2 ammo, and they really suck as LSratters/WH/Nullsec because of their ammo demands. Also since you're all gonna spend about 3-4bil fitting the ship ANYWAYS, get over it. Its like a 500Mil difference. Thats like 7-12 missions. You're probably gonna have a CNR before the Golem anyways

    Cargo Space? Actually I do give this argument credit. CNRs are poor in WHs/Null/LowSec Ratting, not only because of supplying them with ammo. But of staying supplied for a long time. You can load a golem up on ammo and go rat for an entire day, never have to venture near a station. Even better for WHs. Taken mine on ventures in there several times. Just a box O torps, a cloak, and a probe. N gone after sleepers for days under the local corps radar. Then just popping out when the hold starts to get full and none of the locals are online.




    Also TPs still work in bastion. however the ship is immune to ECM and sensor damps. (not to Serp defenders though, or that mission with the 2.5mil raven)




    Edit.
    Actually now that I think of it and have been in game a lot now too. Even the whole speed thing is irrelevant. Old fits still work fine for rolling combat, only with the benefit of an extra high. And in a fit with a MJD, you can just bounce out to the side, wait a min and jump back within range of the gate (requires some basic geometry skill though, heavens forbid). Which is actually faster then the CNR or rolling fights in most cases I've tried.

    CNR 150m/s, 40km = 4.4 mins.
    Golem, 2x jumps, 2 minutes.

    And I usually make the first jump right after entering, and then fight with the added rangetank. Could almost dump the tank off the thing, only things that hurt me so far have been missile boats.
  • December 10, 2013, 04:06:56 am

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    hi

    is since Rubicon the
    - Pith A-Type Large Shield Booster
    better than
    -Pithum A-Type Medium Shield Booster?

    i ask because i have in mind that you use the medium shield Booster in your old fitting....


    by calc on myselfe i get:
    Medium: 228 HP every 3,00 sec -->  76 HP/s
    Large:  343 HP every 3,20 sec --> 107,187 HP/s


    greetings
  • December 10, 2013, 05:38:50 am

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    Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    I used the medium on my old fit, and still use a medium on my CNR because the cap/tank ratio is great, and on those fits i run an afterburner constantly. With the MJD and bastion module, I dont need nearly as much cap for propulsion, and you get a massive boost to shield boost amount, so switching to a large still gives you plenty of cap and tank, but saves you quite a bit of isk on the module.
  • December 10, 2013, 05:59:48 am

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    thanks for your fast answer and explanation!
  • December 17, 2013, 01:47:45 pm

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    charon jinn is working their way up. charon jinn is working their way up. charon jinn is working their way up.

    Really liking this fit.  Would you recommend torps at all in a close-up option? +1
  • December 17, 2013, 07:44:59 pm

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    Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    Absolutely if it's for close range. I usually find that I need the range In most missions, but if you know you are going to
    Be inside around 45k, go for it!
  • December 17, 2013, 09:01:36 pm

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    azile0 might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. azile0 might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. azile0 might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. azile0 might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. azile0 might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. azile0 might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. azile0 might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. azile0 might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. azile0 might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. azile0 might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. azile0 might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. azile0 might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up.

    2 billion is a hefty price tag, plus your faction ammo. How long would it take to recoup the cost?
  • December 18, 2013, 07:46:26 am

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    No faction ammo- just tech 2,

    Estimating about 1 mission every 30 mins, and at about 20-30 mil per mission depending on bounties and loot/salvage, it would be roughly 40 hours of missioning to get the cost back.
  • December 28, 2013, 12:58:06 pm

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    @ghalyen:

    which missile implants would you suggest for this fitting?
  • January 17, 2014, 06:45:28 am

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    I use this fit, but to really get the picture, can someone explain to me why it is better to have rigs that + explosion velocity and reduce signature factor rather than rig that brings +15% damage ?
    Can someone explain in a language that is understandable ?
    And how exactly DP affect damage to battleships ? I can understand damage on frigates, they are small and fast, but will TP increase damage to big slower BS
    Answe is much appreciated
  • January 17, 2014, 07:58:56 am

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    It will affect damage on battleships if you do not have guided missile precision to level 5- At 5, your explosion radius is slightly smaller than that of most battleship hulls. You will notice a big difference in cruiser and BC hulls also, which is what there is usually most of.

    To compare how the damage increase affects applied damage compared to the rigors-

    with rigor- 7935 volley damage,  340 explosion radius

    with calefaction catalyst (which does suffer from stacking penalties with the BCUs)- 8253 volley damage, 425 explosion radius

    So you really only gain 4% damage from that rig, since you already have 4 BCUs racking up the stacking penalties. Your APPLIED damage is going to be slightly higher on battleships with the Calefaction catalyst, but higher on every other ship type, by quite a big margin.

    Lets take a look at the Thorax model cruiser.

    Base sig radius- 120, with 2 RF TPs, bonused 35%- 231

    With the Rigor rig- 231/340 = 68% of your damage is going to apply to the target- so it will take 5,396 of your 7935 volley

    With the Calefaction Catalyst- 231/425= 54% of your damage is going to apply to the target- 4,457 of your 8,253 volley will apply.

    So by using the Rigor rig, you will be doing 21% more damage than with the calefaction catalyst.
  • January 17, 2014, 08:51:44 am

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    Finally i get it now, thanks a lot!
  • January 17, 2014, 09:07:13 am

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    How about explosion velocity bonus, how does that affects damage ?
  • January 17, 2014, 09:14:07 am

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    And one last question, why wouldn't you install 2 rigors instead of 1 rigor and 1 flare ?
  • January 17, 2014, 09:19:57 am

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    Well, missiles never really "hit" the target. they fly to where the target is, and explode. If the target is moving fast enough, he can outrun some or all of the explosion. Your explosion velocity is how fast the sphere of the explosion expands. The faster the explosion velocity, the faster the target has to move to avoid damage.

    I used one rigor and 1 flare on this because the Golem already has a bonus to target painters, and there are 4 of them on this ship, which affects explosion radius/sig radius, but really the only way to apply more damage through explosion velocity, is to speed up your explosion velocity (flare rigs) or slow down the target (webber)- since range on a web is crap, and you have to apply it to work, i like using flares cause they apply to every missile fired, and you dont have to worry about applying it.
  • January 18, 2014, 02:56:34 am

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    That's great insight, thanks!
  • January 18, 2014, 03:45:20 am

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    Ivan St might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Ivan St might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Ivan St might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Ivan St might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Ivan St might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Ivan St might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Ivan St might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Ivan St might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Ivan St might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Ivan St might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Ivan St might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Ivan St might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up.

    +1 for great loadout bro ;)
    Rubicon sure pushed the Tengu off the "best pve ship" spot for good.

    A full T2 loadout Golem can easily outperform a Complex fitted Tengu.
    (Couldn't believe it until I tried comparing my usual Tengu with a T2 fit Golem on level 4 missions on the test server)

    But a good fitting advice: Put in a drone link augmentor, or your drones won't go very far.
  • January 18, 2014, 07:41:05 am

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    This loadout has been updated
  • January 31, 2014, 08:31:55 am

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    How much range these TPs have? Are they effective enough while sniping rats over 200km?
  • January 31, 2014, 08:36:33 am

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    Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    why would you want to be 200km? around 100km is where you want to be, and the rats will close into effective range of the TPs pretty quick. They will make a noticeable difference in your applied DPS, especially with the ship bonus.
  • January 31, 2014, 08:52:27 am

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    Trust me, with SB + range script you can easily target over 200 km. Also cruises can fly that distance. Otherwise if I have to fight from 100km I can do it very well with my cheeper Raven with exactly the same DPS.

    P.S.  I like your fit but I am trying to figure out  what's the difference from CNR or Raven in fight
  • January 31, 2014, 09:15:03 am

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    Damage application is the difference.Paper DPS doesnt mean a thing if you arent applying it. I honestly like a CNR better than the golem, it suits my playstyle better.
  • February 03, 2014, 09:17:17 pm

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    Hi, I have a Noctis alt.  What do you recommend I replace the tractor and salvagers with?
  • February 03, 2014, 11:14:16 pm

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    sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    Festival launchers!
  • February 04, 2014, 03:54:33 am

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    Hi, I have a Noctis alt.  What do you recommend I replace the tractor and salvagers with?

    Drone link Augmentor II x2
    Also you can replace the 2 TP's with hardeners (depends on your current mission) for more safety...

    Fly Safe...
  • February 04, 2014, 07:00:17 am

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    Hi, I have a Noctis alt.  What do you recommend I replace the tractor and salvagers with?

    Drone link Augmentor II x2
    Also you can replace the 2 TP's with hardeners (depends on your current mission) for more safety...

    Fly Safe...


    No you cant replace TPs with hardeners- 750 DPS tank with just the booster is obscene for level 4s.

    a DLA might be useful, but usually the frigates and destroyers you would be using your drones on close range pretty quick anyways,

    I would probably go with auto-targeters, just to lock up a bunch more targets at once, its really not that much benefit, but if you are killing stuff fast enough it might save a little bit of time.

  • February 09, 2014, 08:43:36 am

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    Hey, do you recommend any changes on you fitting to fly in Amarr space (mainly EM/Therm damage)?
    Or ist the tank ability caused by the high range and the ability to jump away at any time enough to make you fitting above viable against every dmg type?
  • February 09, 2014, 08:57:54 am

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    Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    You might want to toss on an em hardener in place of one of the TPs- I'll check numbers when I'm around a computer, but the MJD does help avoid lots of it.
  • February 26, 2014, 02:08:56 pm

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    Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    I never had the problem of being outside of the standard locking range of the golem so i dont even think about using the sebo. Altho its hard to find a usefull module to replace it with. I tried a fed navy web once. It made it very enjoyable to use on frigs lol.

    +1
  • February 26, 2014, 11:47:31 pm

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    dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    The extra scan res is always nice
  • February 27, 2014, 01:27:11 am

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    In most missions you only have to wait to shoot after you warp in. The rest of the time you should always have targets locked already. And avoid shooting trigger ships last so you have the new spawn locked before you are done with the old spawn. Scan res isnt that important IMO.

    BTW why no stats with sustained and omni tank? Or separate dps stats for missiles and drones? Currently it makes it look better than it actually is lol

    Edit: And while im at it. I don't know how reliable EFT is with dps graphs but i have not found a single situation where a T2 flare rig actually gives more dps application than a T2 Rigor rig. No matter how many target painter or webs you put on a target. The difference is only like 5 or 10 dps but still its a difference.
  • February 27, 2014, 05:27:30 am

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    The flare helps more with fast MWD cruisers like the Thorax and Cynabal models. The only other way to have a similar effect on DPS application is through a web, and range on those suck. I didnt include stats with sustained or omni tank because you rarely ever need to in missions. You dont ever need a cap stable tank for missions, anyone who thinks they do hasnt ever even tried to manage their cap before. The LOWEST DPS tank this has is 526 vs Sansha, which is still plenty for level 4s, even without the MJD. Omni damage is 641.  How in the world does combining damage types make the fit look better than it is? You are going to have your drones out working the whole time, so you are going to be doing that much damage.
  • February 27, 2014, 11:28:59 am

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    Well like i said i tried putting AB's and MWD's on slow and fast cruiser and frigs, with big sig or small sig, but in every single situation 2 T2 rigors perform better. For me that has always made sense too since a smaller explosion radius also helps explosion velocity but it doesn't work the other way around.

    And saying you rarely need to omnitank when you fit only a single shield booster (AKA omnitank) is just silly. And the sustained tank still matters in a way that it should not be 0. All im saying is that the more stats you add the better.

    The regular range you operate from is around the 100km, mostly cuz of triangulation with the MJD. At that range you can't use the drones. And you don't support the tank on this fit to get in close and personal under 60km so you can use drones all the time.

    BTW 526 dps vs sansha is still the burst tank, the sustained is around the 270 dps (replacing the MJD with cap recharger). And that is really not enough to run missions with if you dont have the MJD range.
  • February 27, 2014, 12:54:55 pm

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    You don't operate at 100km- the MJD moves you 100km- it he enemy is almost never going to be orbiting you at 0 when you jump. I have tested this ship in the field extensively, and I can tell you from experience that the tank is more than enough and the rigs work better this way. And yea you don't usually need to omnitank, pirate factions deal specific damage types, and you tank against those. Please let me know which mission deals all 4 types of damage equally- I know of none.
  • February 27, 2014, 01:03:35 pm

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    Dread pirate scarlet does require an omnitank.

    But the way it should be done is if you have to move to a gate you mjd in a triangle so you end up 100km from that gate and preferably also 100km away from any rats. Even if you warp in on top of the gate it would be wise to mjd 100km out unless the rats themselves are already at a decent range. Especially angels which get closer faster than one would like.

    And why are you talking about specific resists? This fit doesn't use that.
  • February 27, 2014, 01:35:12 pm

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    Specific resistance if you need them- I have never needed any additional resists though- and yes I know how Micro jump drive works I have been using one since they were released. The fit has been tried and tested man. It works like a charm and applies DPS great. I still do enjoy my Navy Raven better because I prefer something that is constantly moving with afterburner, this ship will apply DPS a little bit better though.
  • February 27, 2014, 09:02:50 pm

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    NIFTYGetAtMe has no influence.

    This is a good fit, but you use torps on a golem. With the range bonus from bastion module and the proper torp rigs, you dont need to even move for Serp/guristas missions. If I were to judge your fit though I would say a 4th tp is not a wise choice given the good enough damage application of cruise missiles with the rigor rig and 3 tps. With range like this you don't need an mjd. You can just drop the mjd and 1 tp and fit tanking items so you can just permatank while you sit there and blast stuff. That said, a torp fit is way better. +1 tho if you insist on using cruises.
  • February 27, 2014, 09:29:05 pm

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    Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    This is a good fit, but you use torps on a golem. With the range bonus from bastion module and the proper torp rigs, you dont need to even move for Serp/guristas missions. If I were to judge your fit though I would say a 4th tp is not a wise choice given the good enough damage application of cruise missiles with the rigor rig and 3 tps. With range like this you don't need an mjd. You can just drop the mjd and 1 tp and fit tanking items so you can just permatank while you sit there and blast stuff. That said, a torp fit is way better. +1 tho if you insist on using cruises.

    Am I really supposed to take advice from the guy who decided to post this?

    http://eve.battleclinic.com/loadout/49407-Domination-Rokh.html

  • February 27, 2014, 11:24:07 pm

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    dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. dmginc308 forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    oh boy
  • February 28, 2014, 02:09:56 am

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    Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    Specific resistance if you need them- I have never needed any additional resists though- and yes I know how Micro jump drive works I have been using one since they were released. The fit has been tried and tested man. It works like a charm and applies DPS great. I still do enjoy my Navy Raven better because I prefer something that is constantly moving with afterburner, this ship will apply DPS a little bit better though.

    You are straying so far from the actual conversation that im just gonna be bold and say that you are plain wrong.

    You have no proof that the flare rig actualy performs better other than you say you tested it. And i really don't think you will be able to "feel" if you do 10 dps more or not.

    So stop being lazy and open eft and fit a golem with 2 rigors and a golem with a flare and rigor. Also open a cynabal and moa and give them both a mwd and ab and if you feel lucky also a shield extender or some nano's. Then open your dps graph and see what i am talking about.



  • February 28, 2014, 03:33:35 am

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    Dude, get of your  :censored: ing eft warrior ass and go fly the damn ship. It's not about 10 dps more, it's about whether or not the different rig will save you a volley or not. And on most ships there is no difference. But on the ships that i have the most trouble taking out, which is the fast MWD cruisers, it does make a difference. It saves at least one volley on those. Go try it for yourself. I promise you will see a difference. EFT is not the end-all of ship fitting. Get out in space and fly the freakin ship !
  • February 28, 2014, 11:34:07 am

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    NIFTYGetAtMe has no influence.

    This is a good fit, but you use torps on a golem. With the range bonus from bastion module and the proper torp rigs, you dont need to even move for Serp/guristas missions. If I were to judge your fit though I would say a 4th tp is not a wise choice given the good enough damage application of cruise missiles with the rigor rig and 3 tps. With range like this you don't need an mjd. You can just drop the mjd and 1 tp and fit tanking items so you can just permatank while you sit there and blast stuff. That said, a torp fit is way better. +1 tho if you insist on using cruises.

    Am I really supposed to take advice from the guy who decided to post this?

    http://eve.battleclinic.com/loadout/49407-Domination-Rokh.html

    Well, yeah you are. You have a mjd to "get in range" or "operate at range" when you can hit every rat in any mission without moving. Just because I trolled some kid moderators 2 years ago doesn't mean I don't have immense experience with the golem as a lvl4 runner. Torps work better. I know from experience and anyone else will say the same. Don't deflect my advice because you don't agree with it; take it into consideration that there are better modules you can have in the mids on this fit.
  • February 28, 2014, 01:16:55 pm

    Crewman
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    Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    Dude, get of your  :censored: ing eft warrior ass and go fly the damn ship. It's not about 10 dps more, it's about whether or not the different rig will save you a volley or not. And on most ships there is no difference. But on the ships that i have the most trouble taking out, which is the fast MWD cruisers, it does make a difference. It saves at least one volley on those. Go try it for yourself. I promise you will see a difference. EFT is not the end-all of ship fitting. Get out in space and fly the freakin ship !

    You're right. I have been sitting in stations all these years just skilling up and playing eft. I don't even know what space looks like. You really opened my eyes.

    In the mean time i'll just advice to use 2 rigors since for that setup there is atleast some kind of proof as opposed to none.

    So instead of getting mad just show me i'm wrong. Maybe if i am wrong you might learn from it yourself aswell.
  • February 28, 2014, 01:26:36 pm

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    Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    No, there really isn't anything else that will benefit the dps or damage application of this ship more, and that is all you need. Torps are not better, they work differently. Damage application isn't as good on cruisers, you can't reach out to some rats in some missions that are 90+ k out.
  • March 01, 2014, 04:42:45 am

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    Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ashley Animus forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Missile_Damage

    Please take your time to read through that calculation part. ALtho the DRF has been changed in the mean time. The rest still stands as it is.

    Edit: Linked the outdated one :/ fixed it
  • March 16, 2014, 09:39:11 am

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    huskybear has no influence.

    nice fit +1
  • March 16, 2014, 09:49:37 am

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    its seem like you all did a lot of work on paper but did not actually try out the ship. The tank on this ship is simply not strong enough in action. I tested it out on level 4 pirate invasion working for the caldari navy and i all most died. please do not fit this tank you will loose your ship

    The ship has plenty of tank, and has been tested. How are your shield tank skills and do you have marauders as level 5?
  • March 16, 2014, 10:53:44 am

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    huskybear has no influence.

     :o
  • March 20, 2014, 08:34:24 am

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    Pilami might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Pilami might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up.

    Hello,
    What do you think about a Large Bay Loading Accelerator II instead the Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II ?
  • March 20, 2014, 08:36:09 am

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    Hello,
    What do you think about a Large Bay Loading Accelerator II instead the Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II ?

    You are going to be suffering from diminishing returns with the BCUs there, so you wont get much benefit, plus even if it was showing more on-paper DPS, the application from the rigor rig is more important anyways. The only thing I would consider putting in place of the rigor is a second flare rig, and thats if you are using all 4 target painters on one target.
  • March 20, 2014, 09:00:17 am

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    Pilami might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up. Pilami might just get shoved out an airlock if they keep it up.

    Hello,
    What do you think about a Large Bay Loading Accelerator II instead the Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II ?

    You are going to be suffering from diminishing returns with the BCUs there, so you wont get much benefit, plus even if it was showing more on-paper DPS, the application from the rigor rig is more important anyways. The only thing I would consider putting in place of the rigor is a second flare rig, and thats if you are using all 4 target painters on one target.


    Thanks for your fast answer.
    For the moment I only use 3 TP (and on the same target) and a Gistum C-Type Adaptive Invulnerability Field  instead the fourth TP.
    Following your answer I will plug a rigor rig.
  • May 07, 2014, 01:16:35 pm

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    Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    This loadout has been updated
  • June 04, 2014, 09:11:52 pm

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    sirpugg has no influence.

    OK.. I like the loadout, but i have a question...

    I have a noctis alt, so for me the 2 x tractors & a salvager are pointless.. so this free's up 3 high-slots.

    I would put a drone link in one, but what would you put in the other 2 high slots?
  • June 05, 2014, 02:43:55 am

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    Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    Auto-targeters, or nothing. For PvE the high slot options outside of weapons are few and far between.
  • June 18, 2014, 05:21:26 am

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    Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    Auto-targeters, or nothing. For PvE the high slot options outside of weapons are few and far between.

    *deadspace NOSes

    ...if they still even do anything on rats...

    also +1

    although still doesn't do as much DPS as the missioning cruise Typhoon fleet issue i use...
  • June 18, 2014, 06:28:10 am

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    sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. sysape forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    Nos definitely work on rats. Work in that you get cap, I don't think they affect the rats any.
  • June 19, 2014, 06:52:49 am

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    Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    Auto-targeters, or nothing. For PvE the high slot options outside of weapons are few and far between.

    *deadspace NOSes

    ...if they still even do anything on rats...

    also +1

    although still doesn't do as much DPS as the missioning cruise Typhoon fleet issue i use...

    Yea the Typhoon Fleet issue will do 30 more DPS with Fury Cruises, but it wont apply nearly as well as the golem has bonuses to both Explosion velocity AND Target painting.
  • June 19, 2014, 10:06:11 am

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    Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Warde Guildencrantz forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    Auto-targeters, or nothing. For PvE the high slot options outside of weapons are few and far between.

    *deadspace NOSes

    ...if they still even do anything on rats...

    also +1

    although still doesn't do as much DPS as the missioning cruise Typhoon fleet issue i use...

    Yea the Typhoon Fleet issue will do 30 more DPS with Fury Cruises, but it wont apply nearly as well as the golem has bonuses to both Explosion velocity AND Target painting.

    But without furies...still does more. And applies it decently.
  • June 19, 2014, 11:41:55 am

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    Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know. Ghalyen forgot more about gaming than you'll ever know.

    Why would you use a cruise boat without furies though?
  • June 30, 2014, 05:06:29 pm

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    Celise Katelo ☆.¸¸.•´¯`♥ has no influence.

    Looks good +1 from me :)
  • June 30, 2014, 05:15:23 pm

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    Why would you use a cruise boat without furies though?

    Sorry, by that i meant it does more DPS than a golem using furies with navy missiles, and applies it reasonably, since a good portion of the DPS is in drones as well. Needless to say, the golem is more reliable.

    Issue is I'm a bit too lazy to paint everything i shoot at
  • August 09, 2014, 07:18:13 am

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    LeeC has no influence.

    When it comes down to it, you wanna know the only real argument for Golem vs CNR.

    Does your mission have a gate 30-40km away?
    BAM you want a CNR.

    Is the mission say... Angel Extravaganza, with every gate right on the warpin, with lots of highdps enemies that like to engage you at close range?
    Get a Golem.

    All other arguments are just BS compared to that.

    Damage application? You're wasting your time bothering with this. DON'T PANIC. Just put a couple TPs and a rigor on it and it'll work. If you waste any more time thinking about this, you'll go insane and spend several dozen mil on T2 rigors you don't need, spend the money more wise.

    Tank? Who needs it with the savage DPS Both ships are capable of, real men never have to cycle their boosters.

    Ewar? Not really an argument anymore, used to be the number 1 thing the CNR had over the golem. Now the Golem wins, but Ewar doesnt really matter much if you're good.

    Skill Requirement? Clearly you haven't been playing Eve long enough to be part of this argument.

    Cost? Well the Golem does cost a bit more to buy initially. But CNRs eat faction/T2 ammo, and they really suck as LSratters/WH/Nullsec because of their ammo demands. Also since you're all gonna spend about 3-4bil fitting the ship ANYWAYS, get over it. Its like a 500Mil difference. Thats like 7-12 missions. You're probably gonna have a CNR before the Golem anyways

    Cargo Space? Actually I do give this argument credit. CNRs are poor in WHs/Null/LowSec Ratting, not only because of supplying them with ammo. But of staying supplied for a long time. You can load a golem up on ammo and go rat for an entire day, never have to venture near a station. Even better for WHs. Taken mine on ventures in there several times. Just a box O torps, a cloak, and a probe. N gone after sleepers for days under the local corps radar. Then just popping out when the hold starts to get full and none of the locals are online.




    Also TPs still work in bastion. however the ship is immune to ECM and sensor damps. (not to Serp defenders though, or that mission with the 2.5mil raven)




    Edit.
    Actually now that I think of it and have been in game a lot now too. Even the whole speed thing is irrelevant. Old fits still work fine for rolling combat, only with the benefit of an extra high. And in a fit with a MJD, you can just bounce out to the side, wait a min and jump back within range of the gate (requires some basic geometry skill though, heavens forbid). Which is actually faster then the CNR or rolling fights in most cases I've tried.

    CNR 150m/s, 40km = 4.4 mins.
    Golem, 2x jumps, 2 minutes.

    And I usually make the first jump right after entering, and then fight with the added rangetank. Could almost dump the tank off the thing, only things that hurt me so far have been missile boats.

    regarding the speed thing (I did read the edit at the bottom), the golem is even faster than that.

    1 min reactivation time right? you can MJD straight away. The reactivation time started WHEN YOU USE IT, not when the jump has taken place. So... by the time you have jumped, you only have about 50s to wait before jumping again. the result? you can move to any spot within 200km in just over a minute.

    an easy way to do the geometry is to zoom out to max and have tactical mode on (the thing that shows circles at ranges). get your pinky finger and thumb at your ship and the 100km line. Next put your thumb over the target destination (for the 2nd jump). then rotate around your thumb till your pinky is over the 100km line from your ship. Next, double click in that direction and press MJD

    TADAH! you are now 100km from the target destination. please wait 50s to jump again.

    p.s. for the love of god dont actually touch your screen, I will not be responsible for finger marks etc.