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king09
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Reputation: 20

a very solid fit as i can see, nice job +1
Neoncamouflage
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Reputation: 13

Hmm, I've always tended to see these ships as easy kills. This is nice. +1

Oh, and 5 points for using a TD. Love those things.
kahhhhhnn
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Reputation: 9

Id run  vespa ec's instead of the valks.
But that's becuase I'm a pansy.
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

Thanks for the ups guys. The way I see it kahh is you dont' need ecm in most cases because of a few reasons. A) If it's a cruiser you will have shut down everything they are running so they wont' be able to keep you there if you want to run. B) If it's a bc you can probably run C) Any time you are in a situation you are going to die with this ship indefinitely, ecm drones aren't going to help. I'm talking about blobs, etc.
Wicked-Prayer
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Reputation: 43

ECM drones dont work half the time.

I like it a lot, i need to get a decent neut boat +1
Parx
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Reputation: 3

look solid to me ...
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

RATE MOAR
Finnbarr
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Reputation: 0

I don't really get it, Seems like they can just orbit outside your scram range and you will never get your neuts onto them.
sangren
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Reputation: 70

I don't really get it, Seems like they can just orbit outside your scram range and you will never get your neuts onto them.

your drones will take care of them even outside of neut range.

looks like a solid setup +1
Meikochan
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Reputation: 0

Very tempted to try it out =)
Valleria Darkmoon
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Reputation: 15

The Arbitrator is one of the best solo cruisers in game.  I run a fit very similar to this (i use 24km point though so if i need to i can pull range without letting them go) and had scenarios like this happen.  Get attacked by 2 intys off station/gates in low sec, start neuting and send out drones one pops, local spikes i neut the other and warp out just as the BC gang lands...WIN. +1
Andallar
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Reputation: 0

I also use a similar setup for mission running, main difference is I swap one neut for a Salvager.  Also nice in small fleets, I throw 5 medium repair drone IIs in the bay, handy to have em around! +1
Gumazoa
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Reputation: 0

So im assuming you have 5 of each drone type: ham, hob, valk, warr.

I understand the use of medium drones on cruiser and BC ships and the use of the small for frigates and drones.
However, I don't quite understand when you would need gallente over minmitar drones.

Could you briefly explain the situations in which you would use the different type of drones?
It would be greatly appreciated from someone new to drones.
EdgeStormer
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Reputation: 4

Gallente drones deal the most dps.

Minmatar drones are the fastest.

Warriors you use on anything that goes faster than 4k/s

Hobgobs you use on anything that goes faster than 2.5k/s

Valks you use on anything that goes faster than 1.5k/s

Hammerheads you use on anything that's under 1k/s
Tiktaalik
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Reputation: 1

Looks good to me :D. +1
Tiktaalik
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Reputation: 1

DO you have powergrid enough to fit a med afterburner II?
bambukinis
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Reputation: 0

Do you realy need that much cap since youre boosting?
dumtes
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Reputation: 0

i cant seem to have enough pg to fit this even with all 5
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

Just realized this was getting upped a lot and some questions. Babnukinis, I don't understand your question, Demtes, I don't know if you are fitting a 1600mm plate instead of an 800, but this fit isn't' even that tight honestly.
bambukinis
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Reputation: 0

Just realized this was getting upped a lot and some questions. Babnukinis, I don't understand your question, Demtes, I don't know if you are fitting a 1600mm plate instead of an 800, but this fit isn't' even that tight honestly.
i mean rigs, is there realy nothing better to put there?
Tiktaalik
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Reputation: 1

Egress Port Maximizers improve neut power, which is good
RandomNecro
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Reputation: 1

i like this fit alot its great even for those people who like me have low SP and wil just fit it T1 and T2 wher possable ... +1 for the awesome fit ...
Captain Gunn
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Reputation: 0

Great fit, I'll be trying this out tonight. As Necro said it's not a tight fit at all so if you're low on SP you still shouldn't have much trouble fitting it together!

+1
knight rider
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Reputation: 29

The way to start amarr:

1)MEM-INT
-learning
-t2 light drones and decent drone skills

2)PER-INT
-punisher
-arbitrator like this
Aiifa
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Reputation: 29

The way to start amarr:

1)MEM-INT
-learning
-t2 light drones and decent drone skills

2)PER-INT
-punisher
-arbitrator like this

good call on that. Works well if you want a dominix mission alt helper too. Training energy emission gets you into a t1 curse and a cap transferring pve domi.
Altheus Fenix
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Reputation: 2

Id run  vespa ec's instead of the valks.
But that's becuase I'm a pansy.
  Then you have nothing to do dmg if you do that, you'll just be neuting but not applying any damage.
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

This loadout has been updated
Yabba Addict
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Reputation: 62

Really not sure about those rigs, they're completely redundant because of the cap booster. Using navy charges you can use 400's, be stable at a massive 80% and hold over 30. Buy yourself a bit of ehp and fit some trimarks, then fit a T2 AB to help out with the speed penalty. Other than that i like the look of this alot, think i'll try it out +1
Mister Sicarius
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Reputation: 0

Beautiful load out.  I'm going to build me one of these.  +1
majnuker
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Reputation: 10

Good looking fit, with a desired goal in mind that it does well.

Niche fits that suit a purpose are always my fav, and though this isn't niche, it is great for what it needs to do.

+1
Flameshadowcore
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Reputation: 9

Yes I love this fit, I'm using it in my war now :) +1

Most useful loadout for my needs I've read yet
Thoroughbreed
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Reputation: 6

I want one! Very nice loadout, definitly going to test it ...

Just bumbin' to save the loadout ;)

+1
Duck Eh
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Reputation: 3

will deff try this +1
MrCue
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Reputation: 648

test
iPheer
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Reputation: 1

Built this ship just today and got a kill. +1 from me.
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

Yabba: 2 things

1) Trimarks on cruisers is a complete waste of money, having 4 non trimarked arbitrators/ruptures/vexors is better than 1 trimakred. The chances that you will do as much damage and gain as much loot with 1 trimarked cruiser as you would with 4 non trimarked is slim to none.

2) trimarks make you too slow to make your td effective, you will not orbit or keep range well enough due to lack of agility and speed.
blair wraith
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Reputation: 0

How does this go against a stabber?
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

Does great against any turret based boats from cruiser and up. With an optimal range script loaded the stabber won't hit you unless he's within 4 or 5k so he'll either have to run or get scrammed and neuted.
blackinton
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Reputation: 1

great pvp fit, enough said +1
blackinton
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Reputation: 1

wait what is the effective range to use this ship
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

Depends what you are fighting, orbit as close as possible with tracking scripts on autocannons cruisers/bcs, try to keep on edge of scram range against blaster boats with optimal range script loaded.
Krennel
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Reputation: 0

RATING MOAR!

In other news, nice fit. +1
explosivechorro
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Reputation: 60

looks good, a t1 fit of this is pretty good too
Cpt Boomstick
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Reputation: 89

Good fit +1
x42i
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Reputation: 0

question about the egress port maximizers - why 3 of them, instead of maybe 2 and 1 drone speed or range rig, or anything else, simply because I'm finding running out of cap is NOT an issue with this setup, even at very low sp's. Cost?

Also, what is the reason for the 3 small neuts? Wouldn't just 2 be pretty similar, with another high slot for a weapon, drone link, or somfin' ?
Cpt Boomstick
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Reputation: 89

question about the egress port maximizers - why 3 of them, instead of maybe 2 and 1 drone speed or range rig, or anything else, simply because I'm finding running out of cap is NOT an issue with this setup, even at very low sp's. Cost?

Also, what is the reason for the 3 small neuts? Wouldn't just 2 be pretty similar, with another high slot for a weapon, drone link, or somfin' ?

You'll be happy you have the extra small if you get more than 1 frig on you.  For the rigs, you dont need all the egresses.  I'd probably run with a targeting rig or 2 for better scan resolution to lock up your targets and enemy drones faster.
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

question about the egress port maximizers - why 3 of them, instead of maybe 2 and 1 drone speed or range rig, or anything else, simply because I'm finding running out of cap is NOT an issue with this setup, even at very low sp's. Cost?

Also, what is the reason for the 3 small neuts? Wouldn't just 2 be pretty similar, with another high slot for a weapon, drone link, or somfin' ?

The rigs are really whatever you want, I don't recommend armor rigs because of the speed issue, and I prefer egresses because I try to drop bcs pretty frequently in arbitrators and the egresses ensure I can still neut even when being neuted.
ragnarok_knight
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Reputation: 7

This thing, this thing is something I like a lot. It's just mean, and it armor tanks. Big plusses for a guy who wants to solo PvP but doesn't want to bother with shield skills.

+1
High5
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Reputation: 0

Love it! +1
explosivechorro
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Reputation: 60

almost killed navy mega in this thing in amamake but had ****** bane warp in on me....
+1
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

Takes you 40 seconds to cap out a Rax.
Meanwhile you have no range control due to him having a web, and he's pummeling you with little tracking problem since your lack of range control means you can't keep a tight orbit on him if he flies decently.
His drones should be enough to finish you off after that.

IMO you need to put all your eggs in one basket and ditch the cap booster for a web, and fit DPS in the highs.
With that setup anyone who enters scram range and has medium guns should be incapable of hitting you.
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

If a rax can hit you at all in this setup then you are doing it wrong. If they get close enough for the optimal range script to be ineffective, then the tracking script is going to basically nullify their guns altogether. They can't even start hitting until about 3k with optimal range, and will only be getting about 60% their dps at 1.5k, any closer and you switch to tracking script and their tracking becomes .05 with ions, slightly more with electrons, slightly less with neutrons. I can pull off .05 transversal in a battleship while webbed. And even then, if a rax can keep range and dps me long enough before I neut him I'd like to know what kind of cap mods he has fit, because I think the lowest I've ever gotten facing a rax is maybe 2/3 armor left. I have several hundred kills in this setup and raxes are pretty much the easiest cruisers to kill out of all of them, even if they are ab fit.
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

Quote
I can pull off .05 transversal in a battleship while webbed.
That sentence is completely meaningless.
Tracking is measured in rad / sec, ie angular speed.
Transversal is just the part of his velocity that's going at a ninety degree angle to the line from him to you, and measured in m/s. You can't compared them without factoring in range.
Moreover, there's no such thing as pulling off a certain transversal in a certain ship. It depends entirely on the other person's movement. Transversal in EvE is always the same for both parties (because EvE is retarded, in fact that's why you can miss if you orbit someone too fast while he stays put).

In the case of the vs Thorax fight, because you're both going at standard cruiser speeds (you're webbed, he has no propulsion mod), you can't keep a tight orbit. Obviously if someone is going x m/s in a straight line, you can't orbit him if your own speed is x m/s.
And just as you can respond by switching to optimal range disruption, it's fair to assume he can respond by coming back closer. It requires micro and a little guessing work as to what script you're using but it's not too bad if he's a decent pilot.

As for cap, 40 seconds is a long time, and then it's pretty much drones vs drones. Sure you can always run away if it goes awry but meh.

Point being a web ensures that he'll practically never hit you and you'll keep a good orbit.
For evidence of this, get an AB + web frig, fly against a Thorax webbing you and shooting you with medium guns.
Then try the same thing without a web, and have the Thorax fly in one direction at max speed. You'll get hit much more because of your lackluster elliptical orbit and the time you trail behind.
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

I meant whatever eve calls the overview column measured in rad/sec instead of transversal. And its very easy to get a tight  orbit on a thorax or to keep range. Nothing you say is going to change what has actually happened in  this ship and what you see on paper. I will gladly prove otherwise if you don't believe me.
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

Your in-game experiences and kill / death stats prove absolutely nothing as they hold no information about how you or the other pilots flew.

Your stupid in-game vs on paper dichotomy is only proof that the people you met in game didn't know what they were doing, because the game behaves exactly as it is hardcoded to, and that's all there is to it.

Take a look at your post. You said that when a ship is flying at some speed in a straight line, you can keep a tight orbit while going at the same speed. Forget about Eve, try and picture that in your head, tell me it works, and come back then.

I'm not saying it's a terrible fit, I'm saying a web is a better choice than a cap booster; instead of being defensive because it's worked well for you and acknowledge that a web is needed to ensure you can tracking disrupt properly 100% of the time.
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

The web is not a better option though, and that's my point, because if you are facing more than one opponent you need the booster to keep on neuting, there are 0 circumstances in which a web over the booster would be a better choice for this fit. An 800mm arbitrator is faster than 90% of other ab cruisers, and I didn't say I could keep a tight orbit on a thorax bee lining while webbed I said it is easy to EITHER orbit tightly OR keep at range, if a thorax is bee lining of course I'm not going to try to get into a tight orbit, I'm going to o/l my ab and burn the opposite direction until I get to the edge of scram range and keep optimal range script loaded, and I guarantee I can keep a thoraxes guns nullified enough until he is capped out and can't AB or shoot or web. If a thorax decides to burn in a straight line he's hurting himself in three ways A) he's letting me easily dictate range, B) he's giving me the time I need to neut him out and C) he's significantly reducing his dps by moving away from me. I can guarantee I tracking disrupt 100% of the time WITHOUT a web, and that's why you are wrong. No matter how "well" a thorax pilot flies, nothing he does will nullify my massive advantage with the td whether I have a web or not. Like I said, he has 2 options be within 1k to apply any dps at all and let me load tracking scripts and continue raping his dps, or run, that's it. The web can help him run if he's smart enough to realize he needs to before I neut him, but it's not going to help him apply dps at all. You are wrong, accept it.
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

Also, you are an idiot if you think EVE behaves exactly as it says in EFT, EFT tells me I get 237 dps with hammerheads, and in reality that's probably not even close. EFT also says an incursus can do upwards of 200dps, but in order to achieve that you have to be within 500m 100% of the time and not moving. The game does behave exactly as it's coded to, and it's coded to act similar to what EFT tells you, not exactly. Get off eft and quit trying to tell people who actually know what they are doing how to fly ship, and figure out some fits in game and not in EFT. As I said, if you think a thorax can beat this because EFT told you it could, I will gladly prove otherwise. I find it hilarious that you can tell me hundreds of kills in an arbitrator are all null and void because they were all against shitty pilots (which they weren't), and because EFT is giving you some numbers you think that contradicts everything EVERYONE else agrees with and not only that but the kills to prove it.
ragnarok_knight
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Reputation: 7

Quote from: petit.padavoine
(because EvE is retarded, in fact that's why you can miss if you orbit someone too fast while he stays put)

I'm pretty sure it's because your guns can only turn so fast due to the mechanical parts having their limitations being that they're in IRL PHYSICS (EVERYONE CALM THE :censored: DOWN I'M A SCIENTIST). And if you take the time to learn how fast your guns can track, you'll be rewarded by trying not to make your orbitals force the guns to try and keep up. Sure, it's not moving, but have you tried shooting a target with a 9mm while on Mario Andretti's spoiler?

I haven't either, but I can guaran-damn-tee you it's harder than a virgin in a strip club.
Aiifa
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Reputation: 29

Quote from: petit.padavoine
(because EvE is retarded, in fact that's why you can miss if you orbit someone too fast while he stays put)

I'm pretty sure it's because your guns can only turn so fast due to the mechanical parts having their limitations being that they're in IRL PHYSICS (EVERYONE CALM THE  :censored:  DOWN I'M A SCIENTIST). And if you take the time to learn how fast your guns can track, you'll be rewarded by trying not to make your orbitals force the guns to try and keep up. Sure, it's not moving, but have you tried shooting a target with a 9mm while on Mario Andretti's spoiler?

I haven't either, but I can guaran-damn-tee you it's harder than a virgin in a strip club.

If you orbit someone stationary or webbed until they are close to stationary, then you can orbit them keeping the stern-bow line of your ship almost exactly on the tangent of your orbit. That means that the normal of your orbit will never veer from the radius directly toward the webbed ship. So your guns don't have to move at all, they just continue pointing in and your ship sort of does the aiming. I think EVE may model this, I'm not sure. The guns of the webbed ship will however have to turn with your orbit, and as the hull itself is close to immobile due to the webs, that means those guns have to do all the turning by themselves. So their tracking will be terrible.

And that is why all gallente ships should get a gigantic, significant agility boost, perhaps even while lowering speed or other things. Oh and fix hybrids. Blasters = ball of firey plasma jizz,  Rails = only subcap turrets that should get greater than 250 dps at 250k, both turrets with smallest turret signature for their class size because plasma slugs going at relativistic speeds hurt even if they graze you :P Sorry to derail the thread.
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

if you are facing more than one opponent
You're kidding right?
They both have webs, so you have no range control whatsoever and no TD mitigation whatsoever, and they kill you before you cap one of them out.
The AB Arbitrator's sole purpose is great damage mitigation against one single target. You're doing it wrong.

Quote
An 800mm arbitrator is faster than 90% of other ab cruisers
By 10 m/s, GZ.

Quote
and I didn't say I could keep a tight orbit on a thorax bee lining while webbed I said it is easy to EITHER orbit tightly OR keep at range, if a thorax is bee lining of course I'm not going to try to get into a tight orbit, I'm going to o/l my ab and burn the opposite direction until I get to the edge of scram range and keep optimal range script loaded
If you can see him going away in a straight line he can see you turning around. Stop assuming people are retards.
Quote
he's significantly reducing his dps by moving away from me.
No he's not, he can burn away in a straight line to have very low transversal without increasing range. It's just a question of direction of movement, not a question of range.
In short he can easily maneuver to stay within 1-3K while keeping very low transversal.

Another reason why it's better to put all your eggs in one basket BTW is that you have no hope of surviving two cruisers. You need DPS to finish stuff off before his buddies warp in, ie turrets in the highs.

Quote
Also, you are an idiot if you think EVE behaves exactly as it says in EFT, EFT tells me I get 237 dps with hammerheads, and in reality that's probably not even close.
Actually that's not what EFT says. EFT says that the damage output of hammerheads hitting 100% of the time is 237 DPS. It also gives you information about their tracking and signature resolution, as well as their optimal range. If you ignore it don't blame EFT.

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EFT also says an incursus can do upwards of 200dps, but in order to achieve that you have to be within 500m 100% of the time and not moving.
My EFT shows optimal range. Does yours not?

Quote
The game does behave exactly as it's coded to, and it's coded to act similar to what EFT tells you, not exactly.
Nope, EFT is coded to model exactly the way the game behaves. And it does. If you use it properly, ie add in a spreadsheet or use the EFT tracking graphs, and model pilot behavior properly, you can get 100% accurate results. If you don't, don't run around screaming about that retarded EFT vs in-game dichotomy, and blame your bad modelling instead.

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Get off eft and quit trying to tell people who actually know what they are doing how to fly ship, and figure out some fits in game and not in EFT. As I said, if you think a thorax can beat this because EFT told you it could, I will gladly prove otherwise.
I don't at all, in fact you do, I'm the one telling you that proper piloting (something that EFT doesn't model) will greatly reduce the effectiveness of your TDing.
Feel free to completely ignore what I'm saying and make baseless ad hominem accusations about me being an EFT hero, it doesn't make your TD work any better.
Quote
I find it hilarious that you can tell me hundreds of kills in an arbitrator are all null and void because they were all against shitty pilots
I'm saying they're null and void unless you have a recording of a Thorax pilot flying properly (which you clearly wouldn't even know given your idea of what a Thorax pilot can do against your Arby). I'm saying that when a Thorax pilot flies properly against you, you won't be able to win by showing him your killboard (although you can probably win by neuting if you kill his med drones with your lights).

Quote
and because EFT is giving you some numbers you think that contradicts everything EVERYONE else agrees with and not only that but the kills to prove it
Where did I ever mention EFT numbers? You're the one mentioning tracking figures and transversal with no idea what you're talking about, remember?
Quote
I can pull off .05 transversal in a battleship while webbed.
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

I'm pretty sure it's because your guns can only turn so fast
Nope.

Quote
If you orbit someone stationary or webbed until they are close to stationary, then you can orbit them keeping the stern-bow line of your ship almost exactly on the tangent of your orbit. That means that the normal of your orbit will never veer from the radius directly toward the webbed ship. So your guns don't have to move at all, they just continue pointing in and your ship sort of does the aiming.
Exactly. Which is why theoretically angular velocity should be different for both parties, and you should be able to hit anything immobile if you're orbiting it, even if you're orbiting it at 100 km/s.
Eve on the other hand is retarded, because you have the same chance to hit when you're orbiting someone at x m/s as when you're being orbited at x m/s (ie it pretends your guns have to move to keep track of the immobile target you're orbiting.
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

You obviously don't understand the game mechanics or this ship well enough to be convinced. If some noob dies for taking your advice that's not on me and I don't know why I'm trying so hard to prevent bad advice, they'll learn eventually. I'm not going to argue with your ignorance anymore, it is too great. BC is full of too many EFT warriors like you who think that because you can plug some mods into an app that it makes you gods of fittings fit to give advice to noobs all over the site, when in reality you guys don't know jack about actually flying the ships in game and are probably too afraid to. You are wrong, everyone but you knows it, and hopefully you and anybody else that listens to you about this fit will learn the hard way before losing too much isk. As I've said, I have several hundred kills in this exact fit, against fantastic players and groups alike (also proving this ship can easily take more than 1 person on at a time), if you want to use a web, go for it, but when you repeatedly die from being capped out don't blame me, and good luck taking bcs on at all. You don't seem to understand that turning takes time, and that td's, especially against blasters basically prevent dps no matter how slow you are moving or how well the pilot is flying. There is 0% chance a thorax pilot can maneuver quickly and well enough to nullify my td, he has to be too close (600m optimal) to apply even half of his damage with the optimal range script, and by the time he's that close it's way too easy to outrun his guns with a tracking script. And even with this we aren't even factoring in the neuts (which despite what eft tells you it takes a lot less than 40secs to cap out a fully activated thorax with staggerd neuts) and even then 40secs is not enough time for me to die.
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

You obviously don't understand the game mechanics or this ship well enough to be convinced. If some noob dies for taking your advice that's not on me and I don't know why I'm trying so hard to prevent bad advice, they'll learn eventually. I'm not going to argue with your ignorance anymore, it is too great. BC is full of too many EFT warriors like you who think that because you can plug some mods into an app that it makes you gods of fittings fit to give advice to noobs all over the site, when in reality you guys don't know jack about actually flying the ships in game and are probably too afraid to. You are wrong, everyone but you knows it, and hopefully you and anybody else that listens to you about this fit will learn the hard way before losing too much isk. As I've said, I have several hundred kills in this exact fit, against fantastic players and groups alike (also proving this ship can easily take more than 1 person on at a time), if you want to use a web, go for it, but when you repeatedly die from being capped out don't blame me
That's a lot of unjustified ad hominem. How ironic that I didn't quote any numbers at all but you're harping on the DERP EFT HERO idea.
Your having succeeded in taking on multiple targets with this (unless it was frigate-hulls) is just evidence that you fight shitty pilots.
As for "dying from being capped out", what are you talking about? I'm not gonna permarun my neuts till I cap myself out. If you're referring to enemy neuts, fit a damn nos.

Quote
good luck taking bcs on at all.
You're kidding right? BCs can easily kill you before they cap out. The arby kills BCs due to the TD and nothing else. The best setup against a BC is staggered noses to prevent from capping out to neuts and web + td. Cap boosters are terrible against neuts. If you've ever flown an active tanked ship you should know that.

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You don't seem to understand that turning takes time
It does for you too. The animation however is virtually instant. Which means he can see you turn as soon as you start, and react instantly.

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There is 0% chance a thorax pilot can maneuver quickly and well enough to nullify my td
That's simply untrue.
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he has to be too close (600m optimal) to apply even half of his damage with the optimal range script
Null.

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despite what eft tells you it takes a lot less than 40secs to cap out a fully activated thorax with staggerd neuts
Staggered neuts don't make him cap out faster, what the hell are you on about. They make him stay capped out 100% of the time when he's fully capped out. It takes exactly as long as EFT says, maybe a tiny bit less if he MWDed a lot before, but slightly more if you stagger neuts due to being half a cycle late.

I don't care about that though. Sure neuts might work. Thing is web + TD will always work, 100% of the time, at no disadvantage whatsoever. They will just die.
ragnarok_knight
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Reputation: 7

Okay, so I was out-scienced. Thank you for the correction Aiifa. I shall remember how that one works.  :thumbsup:

Now, petit.padavoine, why don't you prove you're not an EFT Warrior by posting your KB? I'm pretty sure it'll be an easier way of saying "my opinion has weight kthx" instead of you writing huge walls of text that basically mount to nothing else but calling him stupid for flying the Arbitrator a certain way, and insulting OP's skills by saying he can't kill anything good with this.

Because when it gets down to direct translation, petit, you're just insulting him because he's a bit craftier with his fit than you are and can smoke things you can't.
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

Yeah, I've dropped canes/brutix/harbs in this thing like nobodies business, the neuts don't take as long as you'd think to cap them out and the td is lol when they try to hit you. And don't push him ragnarok, he seriously just has no idea how to fly the ship or what it's capable of, it's a lost cause. Any normal person reading this thread will see he's obviously wrong and hopefully take the fit like it is and not lose a cruiser they can't afford in the first place.
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

Now, petit.padavoine, why don't you prove you're not an EFT Warrior by posting your KB?
I don't need to prove I'm not an EFT Warrior since I'm the one not mentioning numbers, remember?
Regardless, I'm Roland Deschaines; I do mostly corp ganks though so my KB doesn't mean much even though my ISK destroyed / lost ratio is good. I can see where this is going though, regardless of what I say it'll be "lol high sec bear" for the rest of the thread. Enjoy.

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mount to nothing else but calling him stupid for flying the Arbitrator a certain way, and insulting OP's skills by saying he can't kill anything good with this.
So anyone not praising a fit on BC is "just calling the OP stupid for flying it a certain way and insulting his skills?". Well, yes, but that's the idea, it's a forum, people post fits and you comment on what's good and what could be improved.

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Because when it gets down to direct translation, petit, you're just insulting him because he's a bit craftier with his fit than you are and can smoke things you can't.
What's crafty about his fit? Damage mitigation is a form of tank like any other. What he's doing is the equivalent of dual tanking. TD + web ensures he'll be unhittable. Neuts are redundant, and noses are just as good if not better than a cap booster when it comes to surviving enemy neuts.

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Yeah, I've dropped canes
No you haven't, most canes fit double web and easily kill you before they cap out, especially since you don't trimark.

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brutix/harbs
I didn't say you couldn't kill BCs. I said the point of Arby vs BC is TDs, not neuts.

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the neuts don't take as long as you'd think to cap them out
But you don't need to cap them out because they already shouldn't be hitting you due to the TD. Just fit a web to make sure they can't get around that.

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he seriously just has no idea how to fly the ship or what it's capable of, it's a lost cause.
I can see that your experience vs mediocre pilots has led you to believe you can live without a web, but I don't understand why you're so pissed off / adamant that fitting a web is a sin akin to fitting blasters on a Vagabond. How does using an otherwise identical setup which clearly uses the Arby the way it's supposed to be used (mitigate damage, slowly wear down and kill) translate to "having no idea how to fly the ship"?
It's especially ironic that you say this based on your experience vs pilots who lost when they were 2+ against an Arbitrator.
Aiifa
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Reputation: 29

*last words attempted to be had*

Go make your own fit. Let us criticise it in the thread that will follow by suggesting you add a cap booster so you can cap out more frigs.
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

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*last words attempted to be had*
Yes, the reason I'm answering is not because I have something I disagree with, it's because I want to have The Last Word.
It's not like we haven't been mostly repeating the same thing anyway.

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Go make your own fit.
Good idea. Actually BC shouldn't be a forum. People should just post fits. When you want to suggest a change, you don't post about it, you post your own fit with that change.

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Let us criticise it in the thread that will follow by suggesting you add a cap booster so you can cap out more frigs
I started reading that sentence and expected "so you can kill active tankers" to which I would say fair enough, I guess it'd be nice to get the occasional Brutix kill (which is pretty much the only ship that would be a suitable Arby target and require capping out to kill). But frigates?
It's just going to come down to how many there are given that your only DPS is light drones which frig guns eat for breakfast. If you're at the breaking point where they alpha drones before you can do any damage, you're dead.
The only thing neuts will do to help is cap out their guns.
If you spread neuts you won't cap em out fast enough and you won't stop blasters from firing most of their cycles once they're capped out.
If you put em on a single frig you'll die to the others.
Throw in the fact that at least 50% of frigs use ACs (GL capping those out amirite?) and your neuts are p much obsolete.
Arby is meh for fighting frigs anyway, no reason to use it over a light gun thorax / vexor.

The only use I see for a neut vs a frig gang is to gee tee eff oh (stupid bc word filters), ie before you cap out and need the booster anyway. Not like you'd manage to get them all to drop point at the exact same time anyway, and since it only drops for 1 second, it's a lost cause.

BTW, just a sidenote, but it's ironic that the fit is rigged so as not to depend too heavily on cap boosters but the poster is adamant that removing the cap booster is a cardinal sin.
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

BTW, just as a sidenote, but it's ironic that the fit is rigged to be a neut td boat designed to endure multiple frigs and/or cruisers and turret bcs or bs but pete keeps insisting that a web is going to universally improve the fit when he is obviously wrong.

As a final note, the ultimate reason you don't need a web is that most of the ships you will encounter besides frigs will be mwd fit, and so a web does nothing for you except remove your ability to neut almost indefinitely. I mean seriously how often do you encounter ab ruptures or thoraxes in low/null? Even if you do the web provides no solid benefit.
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

BTW, just as a sidenote, but it's ironic that the fit is rigged to be a neut td boat designed to endure multiple frigs and/or cruisers and turret bcs or bs but pete keeps insisting that a web is going to universally improve the fit when he is obviously wrong.
But that's simply not true. There's no way you can endure multiple ships in this, cap booster or not. Tracking disruption, by definition, can only work against a single target, simply because you can only control your own position / direction relative to one target. Even if you had multiple TDs, you won't be able to endure multiple ships.
As for neuting it provides virtually nothing other than nullifying active tank and the opportunity to escape if you're aligned and get the point off for a second. You won't keep multiple ships capped out enough to be unable to shoot their guns (unless they're using lasers, in which case they should have a cap booster anyway).
Using my own words in a retort is a nice rhetorical device but you didn't actually point out any irony, you just stated what you were saying, what I was saying, and concluded that I was wrong. Irony suggests that there's some sort of contradiction.
Since when is my name pete btw?

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As a final note, the ultimate reason you don't need a web is that most of the ships you will encounter besides frigs will be mwd fit, and so a web does nothing for you except remove your ability to neut almost indefinitely. I mean seriously how often do you encounter ab ruptures or thoraxes in low/null? Even if you do the web provides no solid benefit.
We've already been through this. Since he has a web and you don't, his speed is pretty much identical to yours give or take 10 m/s depending on shill hull / plating / rigs. Identical speed = you can't tracking disrupt properly. If you could, then people would fit tracking disruptors instead of webs on their frigates for 1v1s. Range control and a significant speed advantage is a prerequisite for tracking disruption.
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

Ok mate, you are so smart and have obviously flown this ship much more than me or the 110 other people. You must be right and we must all be wrong, and we must have no idea how the game mechanics work but you do, certainly more than us apparently. All my kills and losses and circumstances in which I've been in this ship count for nothing because EFT and you are the god of eve mechanics. There is no possible way any of us are right, despite having fraps and kill boards to prove it. I apologize for ever even thinking to contradict your almighty word.

P.S. turning off ANY cap running mods including blasters/webs/abs/tackle is extremely easy with 3 small neuts, it's called staggering, once they get below 30% they will never have more than 0 cap, and certainly not enough to reactivate tackle or guns.
marxxxfangurl69
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Reputation: 410

man this thread is awesome
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

I kno rite, this guys too stupid to realize nothing he says matters, he will remain wrong.
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

Ok mate, you are so smart and have obviously flown this ship much more than me or the 110 other people. You must be right and we must all be wrong
So what you're saying is that you have nothing to answer except "A LOT OF PEOPLE THINK MY FIT IS GOOD THEREFORE EVERYTHING I SAY IS RIGHT"?

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All my kills and losses and circumstances in which I've been in this ship count for nothing
It's nothing new that most people in Eve suck at the game. Watching any popular PvP videos or actually realizing what's going on when you're flying should be ample evidence of that.
You yourself have already demonstrated it by saying that you killed multiple targets, which should be 100% impossible against even just well-fit ships, regardless of their flying, because you have only one TD.

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because EFT
The only time I mentioned EFT was in the one place where its numbers simply don't depend on the circumstance: the time it takes you to cap out something. Unless you microwarpdrive away for 1 minute to cap em out before engaging them, and they follow you because what smart pilot wouldn't cap themselves out and then fight an Arby, amirite?

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and you are the god of eve mechanics.
I know how the game works. Clearly you don't, because you link transversal to a single ship outside of a situation, confuse transversal and angular, and think staggering neuts makes enemies cap out faster.

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There is no possible way any of us are right, despite having fraps and kill boards to prove it.
I already told you if you can show me a video of you nullifying the damage of a Rax flying properly I would consider that sufficient evidence. I already said so. I also already explained why your kill boards don't mean jack shit.
Watch a couple Kil2 videos. There are so many situations where he should just not be able to kill stuff due to tracking. Yet, the enemies don't orbit, or they fly at 6km instead of 500, and he alphas them. Most people in Eve can't play for shit. Even if this wasn't the case, killboards aren't accurate empirical evidence. They only show a kill, they don't show how you got the kill, and they certainly can't disprove game mechanics.

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I apologize for ever even thinking to contradict your almighty word.
Sarcasm, unfortunately, doesn't make you right.

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P.S. turning off ANY cap running mods including blasters/webs/abs/tackle is extremely easy with 3 small neuts, it's called staggering, once they get below 30% they will never have more than 0 cap, and certainly not enough to reactivate tackle or guns.
I'm well aware of this.
What I said was
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You won't keep multiple ships capped out enough to be unable to shoot their guns
Pay particular attention to the word multiple (bolded for your convenience).

I do like how your only (incorrect) retort that actually concerned what I posted and wasn't just generic sarcastic "lol i guess u no everything then" was relegated to a P.S. though, it's quite representative of your posting.
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

Ok mate.
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

Good to know we're on the same page.
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

Ok mate.
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

Good to know we're on the same page.
ragnarok_knight
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Reputation: 7

hurr-durr i wuz rong now mah butt is n teh painz

Cool story bro.
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

hurr-durr i wuz rong now mah butt is n teh painz
I like how you imply a past (wrong) to present (butthurt about being proven wrong) progression, which implies my wrongness was somehow demonstrated, when all that he replied was "I killed people with it hence it must be the optimal fit".

I also like the irony of you showing your thread in this face after your beyond-stupid post about turret turning.

Finally, I have to say you very much overestimate the importance I attach to the opinions of Sentiax, and his ability to cause my butt to hurt.
ragnarok_knight
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Reputation: 7

MAH ASS! IT BURNS!

I love how easily trolled you are. I was wrong, but I didn't go on making walls of text proving why I shouldn't be wrong. I took my error like a good little boy and that was that. I enjoy you and your inability to just let it go, and accept that you were wrong. You go for the last word on things like some kind of child.

Ok mate.
Bap181
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Reputation: 0

MAH ASS! IT BURNS!

I love how easily trolled you are. I was wrong, but I didn't go on making walls of text proving why I shouldn't be wrong. I took my error like a good little boy and that was that. I enjoy you and your inability to just let it go, and accept that you were wrong. You go for the last word on things like some kind of child.

Ok mate.

Since you brought it up earlier, wheres your killboard? Kthxbai

As for the actual discussion, Petit is right, but regardless, I think its funny OP thinks he can take on more than a single retarded cruiser with this. 2 retarded cruisers/frigs will kill this instantly. I can probably kill this with a caracal.
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

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I love how easily trolled you are.
Nobody's trying to troll me. You misunderstand what trolling is. Both you and Sentiax are perfectly serious when you say you think I'm wrong.

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I was wrong, but I didn't go on making walls of text proving why I shouldn't be wrong. I took my error like a good little boy and that was that.
Because you were wrong!

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I enjoy you and your inability to just let it go, and accept that you were wrong. You go for the last word on things like some kind of child.
The difference being that I'm right.

As for "the last word", that's just an argumentative fallacy.
First of all, saying "you just want to have the last word" is just a way for you to have the last word.
Second of all, you can pretend that if the other person answers and tells you what's wrong about what you said, they're being quote unquote immature, that doesn't make it true.
Third of all, you'd have to be pretty thick to consider who speaks last in an argument the determining factor for determining who's right. In this case for instance, Sentiax kept repeating something, and I kept repeating why it wasn't true. He could speak last, it would still remain obvious that I was right because I had previously answered the exact same thing.
Feel free to keep on considering that the "mature" thing to do in a discussion is both parties state what they think and then walk away happily with no further interaction.
Bap181
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Reputation: 0

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I love how easily trolled you are.
Nobody's trying to troll me. You misunderstand what trolling is. Both you and Sentiax are perfectly serious when you say you think I'm wrong.

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I was wrong, but I didn't go on making walls of text proving why I shouldn't be wrong. I took my error like a good little boy and that was that.
Because you were wrong!

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I enjoy you and your inability to just let it go, and accept that you were wrong. You go for the last word on things like some kind of child.
The difference being that I'm right.

As for "the last word", that's just an argumentative fallacy.
First of all, saying "you just want to have the last word" is just a way for you to have the last word.
Second of all, it's just a way of having a final say while pretending that if the other person answers and tells you what's wrong about what you said, they're being quote unquote immature.
Third of all, you'd have to be pretty thick to consider who speaks last in an argument the determining factor for determining who's right. In this case for instance, Sentiax kept repeating something, and I kept repeating why it wasn't true. He could speak last, it would still remain obvious that I was right because I had previously answered the exact same thing.
Feel free to keep on considering that the "mature" thing to do in a discussion is both parties state what they think and then walk away happily with no further interaction.

Dude....he killed 3 frigs, a thorax and a hurricane at the same time...and they were super good, obviously.

How can you deny this fit?
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

MAH ASS! IT BURNS!

I love how easily trolled you are. I was wrong, but I didn't go on making walls of text proving why I shouldn't be wrong. I took my error like a good little boy and that was that. I enjoy you and your inability to just let it go, and accept that you were wrong. You go for the last word on things like some kind of child.

Ok mate.

Since you brought it up earlier, wheres your killboard? Kthxbai

As for the actual discussion, Petit is right, but regardless, I think its funny OP thinks he can take on more than a single retarded cruiser with this. 2 retarded cruisers/frigs will kill this instantly. I can probably kill this with a caracal.

1
2
3

Stats for my baby amarr character included, which is more than enough evidence. Not even letting you see my old one. Also, LOL at caracal taking this on. I have one loss to a single cruiser, which is a vexor who was slaved and trimarked, which makes sense because my td doesn't benefit me in that case.
 
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

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LOL at caracal taking this on
[Caracal, AML]
Damage Control II
Ballistic Control System II

Y-S8 Hydrocarbon I Afterburners
Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II
Invulnerability Field II
J5b Phased Prototype Warp Scrambler I

Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Bloodclaw Light Missile
Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Bloodclaw Light Missile
Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Bloodclaw Light Missile
Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Bloodclaw Light Missile
Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Bloodclaw Light Missile

Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Medium Core Defence Field Extender I


Hobgoblin II x2

Hmm, it does 177 DPS, and has 35K ehp, not to mention that it can alpha your drones should it chose to.
I guess that kinda rapes your 19K EHP and 238 DPS, doesn't it?

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I have one loss to a single cruiser, which is a vexor who was slaved and trimarked, which makes sense because my td doesn't benefit me in that case.
LNBs do a lot of damage which you should have been negating, and killing Ogres is relatively easy. You should've been able to win.

GZ at your ratio; oh wait, it's RvB (a bad excuse for PvP), virtually none of it is solo, it's not that impressive to begin with, and as discussed before, even if it were all impressive 0.0 soloing, it would prove absolutely nothing due to providing no information as to how your foes flew their ships.

I guess your epeen is that much bigger though huh?

EDIT: none of the KBs you linked have even used the damn Arby in the last three months. What the hell are you out to show? That you're not a complete scrub with < 50% ratio? Pathetic.
Bap181
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Reputation: 0

1V1 caracal vs arby bro. Lets do it.
marxxxfangurl69
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Reputation: 410

I'm too lazy to find a picture of someone swinging they dick/ballsack back and forth between their legs. If I had one of these on hand, i would post it here right now. true story.
ragnarok_knight
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Reputation: 7

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I love how easily trolled you are.
Nobody's trying to troll me. You misunderstand what trolling is. Both you and Sentiax are perfectly serious when you say you think I'm wrong.

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I was wrong, but I didn't go on making walls of text proving why I shouldn't be wrong. I took my error like a good little boy and that was that.
Because you were wrong!

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I enjoy you and your inability to just let it go, and accept that you were wrong. You go for the last word on things like some kind of child.
The difference being that I'm right.

As for "the last word", that's just an argumentative fallacy.
First of all, saying "you just want to have the last word" is just a way for you to have the last word.
Second of all, you can pretend that if the other person answers and tells you what's wrong about what you said, they're being quote unquote immature, that doesn't make it true.
Third of all, you'd have to be pretty thick to consider who speaks last in an argument the determining factor for determining who's right. In this case for instance, Sentiax kept repeating something, and I kept repeating why it wasn't true. He could speak last, it would still remain obvious that I was right because I had previously answered the exact same thing.
Feel free to keep on considering that the "mature" thing to do in a discussion is both parties state what they think and then walk away happily with no further interaction.
This is too easy.

EDIT: I'm not posting my KB because I'm not the one trying this fit. It's you trying to say how it's wrong, not me. This guy's got kills with it, so it works. Yet you insist it doesn't.
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

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This guy's got kills with it, so it works. Yet you insist it doesn't.
So by your logic, if I got kills with an armor tanked Drake due to fighting retards, it would be the optimal way of fitting it?
Retard.

Case in point: had he had a light neutron + trimarks fit, he would've killed the vexor's drones easily, tanked it, and won eventually, or at least forced a "neither of us can do damage" stalemate.
BUT NO THE MOST IMPORTANT PART IS THE NEUTS AND THE CAP BOOSTER :<).
marxxxfangurl69
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Reputation: 410

back and forth, back and forth. just floppin yr dicks.
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

1V1 caracal vs arby bro. Lets do it.

Also your killboards are terrible, hide those things back under the bed where they belong.

Ok where? What's your in game name? If my kb is so terrible let's see yours.

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LOL at caracal taking this on
[Caracal, AML]
Damage Control II
Ballistic Control System II

Y-S8 Hydrocarbon I Afterburners
Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II
Invulnerability Field II
J5b Phased Prototype Warp Scrambler I

Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Bloodclaw Light Missile
Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Bloodclaw Light Missile
Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Bloodclaw Light Missile
Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Bloodclaw Light Missile
Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Bloodclaw Light Missile

Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Medium Core Defence Field Extender I


Hobgoblin II x2

Hmm, it does 177 DPS, and has 35K ehp, not to mention that it can alpha your drones should it chose to.
I guess that kinda rapes your 19K EHP and 238 DPS, doesn't it?

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I have one loss to a single cruiser, which is a vexor who was slaved and trimarked, which makes sense because my td doesn't benefit me in that case.
LNBs do a lot of damage which you should have been negating, and killing Ogres is relatively easy. You should've been able to win.

GZ at your ratio; oh wait, it's RvB (a bad excuse for PvP), virtually none of it is solo, it's not that impressive to begin with, and as discussed before, even if it were all impressive 0.0 soloing, it would prove absolutely nothing due to providing no information as to how your foes flew their ships.

I guess your epeen is that much bigger though huh?

EDIT: none of the KBs you linked have even used the damn Arby in the last three months. What the hell are you out to show? That you're not a complete scrub with < 50% ratio? Pathetic.

Only about 15% of my kills are in RvB, and if you think RvB is bad at pvp I dare you to war dec them. They will ass rape you to yesteryear.
ragnarok_knight
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Reputation: 7

This turned into "my killboard is better than urz nub"

Mission accomplished.
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

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Only about 15% of my kills are in RvB, and if you think RvB is bad at pvp I dare you to war dec them. They will ass rape you to yesteryear.
ROFLMAO.
"If you wardecc an alliance with a shitton of players who only fly in gangs of 20+, they will ass rape you to yesterear". GZ GZ pr0skill.

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This turned into "my killboard is better than urz nub"
Nope, in fact he's the only one who posted his KB, it's just ironic that after defending his Arby on the sole basis that " :censored: theory, I killed so many guys with it" it turns out he has no Arby kills whatsoever, plays in RvB, and has barely any solo kills.

I don't understand how a second ago you were saying "he has good KB so it works" and now you're saying posting KBs is stupid.

Anyway, I've never endorsed his KB BS, so I'm not a part of this.
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

You do know that at least 80% of my kills are solo right, a quick look at the eve-kill archive stats will show you this? And if you ask the RvBers how often I solo I'm sure they'll confirm that it's nearly always. If, by your own admission, fighting people, no matter how good they are, who only fly in 20 or more fleets solo is not up to your standards then not only are you an ignorant fool, you are also a hypocrite. Even looking at my first few pages of BC MOST of my kills are solo even recently. Either you are blind or can't count, take your pick. But we all know your response is just going to be some other nonsensical argument claiming about how you are better than me and I'm wrong despite having proof and you having nothing but EFT and your own angry little world. It's hilaroius to me that all this is coming from you, someone who only kills mission runners. As I've said over and over, if you are so adamant about your fit vs my fit I will gladly fight a thorax for you (with you in it of course because you have insisted so much in this thread that you are the only perfect pilot in eve). I'm even willing to fight a lol caracal despite it pretty much being the counter and having nothing to do with a td vs web.


As a final note, I love that you are posting with your alt to add more downvotes to the thread and make it seem as though you have support. It's also good to see you flying in RvB so you will understand that though there are noobs, most of them aren't retards. In fact I think I'm going to rejoin blue just so I can teach you how to play eve.
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

LOl it seems you've developed quite a reputation in RvB they have confirmed that you are an angry man who insists everyone's fit sucks, and that you are indeed as stupid as I thought.
23gabe
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Reputation: 488

CHILL OUT
Bap181
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Reputation: 0

CHILL OUT

Still need help with tracking mechanics? I'll help you understand them like last time of you want. I'm free on monday to friday nights, 100mill per hour.
23gabe
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Reputation: 488

CHILL OUT

 I'll help you understand them like last time of you want.
how does english comprehension?
Bap181
*
Reputation: 0

CHILL OUT

 I'll help you understand them like last time of you want.
how does english comprehension?
Am I not banned yet?

:Surprised:
23gabe
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Reputation: 488

well this is a fine fit for killing certain ships, other ships obviously would be better at killing this then others. Just like an assault missile caracal is awesome at killing frigs but vs a drake it would die in a fire, etc.
Can we all agree at that?
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

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a quick look at the eve-kill archive stats
I guess that's why you linked your BC killboards, amirite?

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If, by your own admission, fighting people, no matter how good they are, who only fly in 20 or more fleets solo is not up to your standards then not only are you an ignorant fool, you are also a hypocrite.
What? How am I a hypocrite? When did I say I would fight anyone regardless of numbers?
I'm just mentioning that saying RvB would kill me if I wardecced them isn't exactly a proof of skill, it's a proof of numbers. Most people in RvB can't fit for shit, and most of the fights are arranged frig blobs with little more than "we had more numbers we win" mattering.

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Even looking at my first few pages of BC MOST of my kills are solo even recently.
Sentiax Alpha first page: 5/20
Sentiax Epsilon first page: 9/20
Xaitnes: Battleships on stations vs cruisers, gz
Anyway, I don't give a shit, I was just pointing out the irony of you basing your entire argument on your KBs and then them turning out to be mediocre when you finally post em.

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someone who only kills mission runners
What I've killed and what I haven't, as I said previously, doesn't change game mechanics. I'm not saying "your KB is bad mine is better". I'm highlighting the contradiction b/e your adamant "I haz good KB so my fit works" and the lackluster KB.

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As I've said over and over, if you are so adamant about your fit vs my fit I will gladly fight a thorax for you
I didn't say the Thorax would win. It depends on how good he is at microing his drones, how good you are at microing your drones, and anyway I fly Raxes with Light Neutrons. I said you'd have a much easier time winning 100% of the time with a web, which would enable you to add small guns for much needed DPS and drone-killing duties. It's just a better fit.

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I'm even willing to fight a lol caraca
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Also, LOL at caracal taking this on
Contradiction much bro?

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As a final note, I love that you are posting with your alt to add more downvotes
I don't vote on fits, the voting system is broken due to 90% of posters and most of the mods not knowing the game mechanics.
I also don't have an alt, IDK what makes you think that.

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make it seem as though you have support
Seeing as I previously told you I couldn't care less about the numbers of supporters you had, I don't really want / need support.

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most of them aren't retards
Simply not true. The vets are more retarded than the newbies most of the time, because they're so used to the stupid RvB format, and it's so far removed from real PvP that they can get away with flying stupidly.

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who insists everyone's fit sucks
No, I insist that the fits that suck suck. If they didn't suck I wouldn't say they did.

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Can we all agree at that?
No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that it should be better fit for its intended role, and against the ships that it should win against. I'm obviously not criticizing it because it can't kill a bloody neut Typhoon :/
23gabe
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Reputation: 488

like i said, and this is with any fit, other ships can kill this, it would be tough for say, a thorax to beat this, but he could.
Most of the time it comes down to an individuals skill level at playing the game, not only his skillpoints.
Alone this fit is fine for attacking certain ships, and is good set up. It of course is not a win button, but against certain ships it is quite good.
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

That doesn't change the fact that it would be much better for attacking those certain ships if it used a web and small guns + a couple noses.
Bap181
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Reputation: 0

well this is a fine fit for killing certain ships, other ships obviously would be better at killing this then others. Just like an assault missile caracal is awesome at killing frigs but vs a drake it would die in a fire, etc.
Can we all agree at that?

Yes, yes we can. All we were saying is that the ship is badly designed. The neuts and cap booster are a cool but unecessary addition as the real tank of the ship is the TD, not the neuts. Putting a web on this ship would maximize its utility as a TD ship and make sure people that know how to fly dont lower transversal and kill this ship in a hanfull of volleys before you can respond with range script and etc.

The neuts are a cool addition, and are usefull to a certain extent but the cap booster isnt. I'd be perfectly fine with the same fit except with a web instead of the cap boosters. Plus, the cap booster isnt that needed considering the egress ports.

The real issue is that he says he can take on multiple people with this ship by neuting and TD's people and thus needs the cap booster. That's just not true. 2 ships of any kind will rape you, bar T1 frigs maybe. Saying you can take on multiple (if a single) cruisers and above in this ship is just a bad joke.

Also Sentiax, we still like you, its people like you who make eve great.
23gabe
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Reputation: 488

That doesn't change the fact that it would be much better for attacking those certain ships if it used a web and small guns + a couple noses.
i'd say neuts over nos, but go ahead and post that as an alternative fit
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

Quote
i'd say neuts over nos, but go ahead and post that as an alternative fit
Nos for neut protection since no cap booster. Lets you take on Harbs and stuff.
23gabe
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Reputation: 488

Quote
i'd say neuts over nos, but go ahead and post that as an alternative fit
Nos for neut protection since no cap booster. Lets you take on Harbs and stuff.
make a fit we will discuss it there
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

And you think it's a better idea to split the discussion thread in two because...?
marxxxfangurl69
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Reputation: 410

swoosh, swoosh, swoosh

or actually more like flip, flop, flip, flop

also, post the goddamn fit, link it here, it sounds like a very different ship and like comparing apples and oranges

neut platforms rule, they can help hugely in gangs and when rolling solo it is OKAY for a T1 cruiser to be in the rock-paper-scissors thing that solo often devolves into. this ships works, it is neuty and sexy, etc

a blaster arby, if you can post a good one, sounds "neat" and I would love to see it
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

Quote
very different ship
It's not, it does the exact same thing (solo with mitigation tank through kiting or sig tanking), it just does it better. You can't just slap neuts onto a ship because NEUTS ARE GOOD. Think of why this ship works, what it can engage, and what would it help it engage more targets / engage the current ones better.
Are neuts an integral part of a good Arby fit? Nope.

Quote
neut platforms rule, they can help hugely in gangs
It's not a gang ship.
If you wanted a gang cruiser for neuting, you'd use a Vexor, because a mitigation tank like the Arby's is just stupid in a gang (try keeping transversal high vs two different guys at the same time), and the Vexor actually gets respectable drone DPS with 2/2/1, unlike the Arby.
The only point of neuts on this ship is to kill an active tanking ship like the Brutix, and due to the Arby's terribly lackluster DPS it would probably be able to tank you anyway with just the rep cycles it can get from cap booster pulses.

Quote
OKAY for a T1 cruiser to be in the rock-paper-scissors thing that solo often devolves into.
I'm not at all contesting that, on the contrary I fully endorse mitigation tanking, which rapes blaster ships and in turn gets owned by drone boats and light gun ships.
What I'm saying is, he's doing it wrong, and fitting a web and light guns is better than a cap booster and neuts.

Quote
a blaster arby, if you can post a good one, sounds "neat" and I would love to see i
I don't need to post it, it's pretty self-explanatory: two LNBs, two small noses, 1600 plate dc eanm eanm web ab td scram. Add an ancillary for a med nos if you feel like it.
30% more damage, better neut protection, more tank, better damage mitigation, and nothing of value was lost.
marxxxfangurl69
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Reputation: 410

I refuse to be sucked into this. Is there a way to unsub from a thread?
Aiifa
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Reputation: 29

swoosh, swoosh, swoosh

or actually more like flip, flop, flip, flop

also, post the goddamn fit, link it here, it sounds like a very different ship and like comparing apples and oranges

neut platforms rule, they can help hugely in gangs and when rolling solo it is OKAY for a T1 cruiser to be in the rock-paper-scissors thing that solo often devolves into. this ships works, it is neuty and sexy, etc

a blaster arby, if you can post a good one, sounds "neat" and I would love to see it

HAYLOOKIT a cogent contribution to the conversation for the first time in this latter half the threadnaught

so if solo pvp devolves into rock paper scissors, what is the counter to a well-tanked mwd hm drake or buffer missile boats in general? I've always wondered.
petit.padavoine
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Reputation: 46

Quote
what is the counter to a well-tanked mwd hm drake or buffer missile boats in general?
I read "MWD HM drake" and assumed you meant nano / kiting but then you said "or buffer missile boats" so I don't really see what you mean.

If you mean nano, same as any other nano ship, neuts or ships with long range guns (Scorch harb).
If you mean THE SHEER POWER OF THE HML DRAKE RAWR, HML Drakes are pretty meh statswise, HAM Drake used to be impressive but just gets dominated by the Cane since the boost to AC damage and damage types.
ragnarok_knight
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Reputation: 7

Quote
very different ship
It's not, it does the exact same thing (solo with mitigation tank through kiting or sig tanking), it just does it better. You can't just slap neuts onto a ship because NEUTS ARE GOOD. Think of why this ship works, what it can engage, and what would it help it engage more targets / engage the current ones better.
Are neuts an integral part of a good Arby fit? Nope.

Never mind those neuts are what change you from a DPS shooty-shooty SOLO TIEMZ boat into a control ship. I'm pretty sure the control those neuts will give you will be as good as a web, and will allow your drones to smoke 'em. The neuts kill ABs, they kill hardeners, and when neuted out 100%, they'll kill DCUs and make your day easier. Sure, you won't be able to stop them from just slowboating around like you would with a web, but if they can only slowboat then they're dead anyways, especially in a solo engagement away from a station/WH/gate.

Quote
I don't need to post it, it's pretty self-explanatory: two LNBs, two small noses, 1600 plate dc eanm eanm web ab td scram. Add an ancillary for a med nos if you feel like it.
30% more damage, better neut protection, more tank, better damage mitigation, and nothing of value was lost.

Post. Your. Fit. Quit demanding someone else update theirs to fit your completely different definition of a solo Arbitrator. We'll discuss your fit there, where you can have your own section of the site devoted to trying to convince us you're right. This is the OP's fit, and his philosophy is 'if it hurts it works,' and obviously from what he's provided this fit hurts a whole Hell of a lot in 1v1.
petit.padavoine2
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Reputation: 2

Quote
I'm pretty sure the control those neuts will give you will be as good as a web
Yep, but investing in a web is much cheaper than investing in neuts and a cap booster.
Like I said, the web fit gets 30% more damage, better neut protection, more tank, better damage mitigation, and nothing of value was lost, even according to you ("the control the neuts give me is as good as a web"). And this is regardless of the fact that has already been amply debated that the neuts are actually less good than the web.

Quote
The neuts kill ABs, they kill hardeners
The assumption of this fit is that the enemy isn't AB fit. If he's using AB / web the fit will die anyway.
As for hardeners, nobody uses them, people use EANMs unless they're active tanking and have a cap booster anyway.

Quote
they'll kill DCUs
/facepalm, no, no they won't

Quote
completely different definition of a solo Arbitrator.
TD mitigation tank with some buffer and chew through them with drones. It's the same damn thing.
But even assuming that one is completely different from mine, it doesn't change the fact that this one is vastly inferior, which is reason enough to post in this thread, because being vastly inferior than other fits for the same job is something that should be discussed.

Quote
obviously from what he's provided this fit hurts a whole Hell of a lot in 1v1.
Do we really need to do this again?
Killboards show nothing because:
* We don't see how the ships were flown / the context (RR? Damaged before the beginning of the fight?)
* We don't know how good the enemy pilots were
* HE HASN'T USED THE ARBITRATOR ON THE KILLBOARDS HE LINKED (or at least not in the last three months, and I'm not gonna dig any deeper than that).
* Even assuming that the killboards were evidence that the fit worked, that does not mean that another fit won't work better.

You've displayed your ignorance enough with the post about tracking and the mention of hardeners and turning off a DCU. Why are you still posting?

marxxxfangurl69
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Reputation: 410

Quote
what is the counter to a well-tanked mwd hm drake or buffer missile boats in general?
I read "MWD HM drake" and assumed you meant nano / kiting but then you said "or buffer missile boats" so I don't really see what you mean.

If you mean nano, same as any other nano ship, neuts or ships with long range guns (Scorch harb).
If you mean THE SHEER POWER OF THE HML DRAKE RAWR, HML Drakes are pretty meh statswise, HAM Drake used to be impressive but just gets dominated by the Cane since the boost to AC damage and damage types.

I think they meant HAM.

and the asnwer afaik: just beast them using raw stat. :(

oh also I've seen well-sig-tanked frigs, with an assolad of luck, ruin a medium or large missile boat's day.
ragnarok_knight
*
Reputation: 7

Quote
obviously from what he's provided this fit hurts a whole Hell of a lot in 1v1.
Do we really need to do this again?

You're the ignorant one here, my friend. I wasn't saying his killboards. By 'what he's provided' I was saying the detailed explanation on how he flies his ship, his comments after, and the such.

At least I don't need to make alts in order to beat a dead horse.
marxxxfangurl69
*
Reputation: 410

Quote
obviously from what he's provided this fit hurts a whole Hell of a lot in 1v1.
Do we really need to do this again?

You're the ignorant one here, my friend. I wasn't saying his killboards. By 'what he's provided' I was saying the detailed explanation on how he flies his ship, his comments after, and the such.

At least I don't need to make alts in order to beat a dead horse.

trust him, he's a scientist
petit.padavoine2
*
Reputation: 2

Quote
You're the ignorant one here, my friend
I like how you ignored all the reason I said you were ignorant, and just said "no u".

Quote
I was saying the detailed explanation on how he flies his ship
You mean the part where he blatantly proves that he's never gone against any decent pilot, doesn't know that the turning animation is instant and assumes that no Thorax pilot can do even the most basic anti-TD maneuvers? The part where he says he'll kill a Caracal easily? The part where he thinks he can give transversal stats for a battleship without context?

Quote
At least I don't need to make alts in order to beat a dead horse.
GZ, there's no idiot mod who dislikes you because you proved him wrong about tracking almost a year ago. Such an accomplishment.
ragnarok_knight
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Reputation: 7

Is that sarcasm or do I lol?

I lol'd either way.
petit.padavoine2
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Reputation: 2

You mean you have nothing to say but still won't admit your posting has been comical at best?
"OK".
ragnarok_knight
*
Reputation: 7

I wasn't asking you if it was sarcasm. You weren't the one that said "trust him he's a scientist."

And honestly pissing off a mod shouldn't be something you gloat over like a leprous retard. Just sayin'

EDIT: wtf does GZ mean? I know 'gg,' 'gf,' 'please consider another option, thanks!,' and 'gd.' I don't know what you're saying when you go GZ, and I'm assuming it means something like 'gg,' but why you wouldn't just do that is beyond me.
Aiifa
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Reputation: 29

...nothing to say...

Post your fit?
urasamis
*
Reputation: 1

ive flown with and against sentiax many times and he is an arrogant arse but he is prob the best pilot ive seen in game. After having come across this arb of his it gets a +1 from me.
Sentiax
*
Reputation: 70

lol while I appreciate the flattery I'm no where near the best pilot in the game, I'm mediocre at best. But thanks for the input on the arb.
Wirblewind
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Reputation: 6

Why does this thing have so many +? its cap stable with just the booster ????? why the egress rigs?
Sentiax
*
Reputation: 70

There is no such thing as cap stable with boosters. If you'd read the comments above this has been discussed several times over. A) egresses are cheap, very cheap B) armor rigs slow you down too much to keep your td effective C) egresses allow you to boost LESS which gives you more staying power in case there are multiple targets and allows you to neut much longer in fleet fights.
Sashi Serakhoi
*
Reputation: 1

I must be missing something on this loadout . . . got it loaded into EFT exactly as it appears at the top of the thread.
Set to All Level V skills: Says requires 1220 / 718.75 powergrid?

You gotta have some kinda powergrid booster hardwiring to fly this or what?

Sorry if my mistake, but gotta -1 it till that is clarified for me. I've got a toon on the Pilgrim path and this seems like a neat goal, but I'm not convinced it is even doable.
Sentiax
*
Reputation: 70

You are probably fitting a 1600mm plate instead of an 800mm.
Thrawn_Endashi
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Reputation: 1

Quote
they'll kill DCUs
/facepalm, no, no they won't

Actually, they will kill a DCU if its cycle goes off before the capacitor pulls regen. I've had it happen.
Sentiax
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Reputation: 70

Quote
they'll kill DCUs
/facepalm, no, no they won't

Actually, they will kill a DCU if its cycle goes off before the capacitor pulls regen. I've had it happen.

Just give up, he's incorrigible.
SiTodd
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Reputation: 0

Sorry to necro this thread but I had a question. Farther up in the thread before it was derailed, the OP said the rigs are pretty optional. He uses the egress because it helps when he fights neut boats with a neut boat but anything was fine with anything but trimarks because they slow the boat down to much. The question is how important is the 3 smalls when it comes to staggering them to keep somebody out of cap. By putting 2 PG Rigs in you are able to fit 2 mediums and 2 small neuts instead of 1 medium and 3 smalls. This gives you more of a cap damage burst at the start of the fight. This will instantly cut down smaller ships cap and run an average cruiser out in about 4 seconds. The small neut/ egress build runs out of cap in 1m 16sec and the 2 medium/PG rig runs out in 49 seconds (with my skills).

So to recap because I ramble, 49 seconds vs 1m16 sec, is this bad if your packing boosters? Can you stagger 2 medium and 2 smalls to keep somebody at 0 cap or do you need 3 smalls to do so.
DerArt1st
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Reputation: 1

The amount of bullshit in this thread is amazing. Since when do neuts disable damage controls of a halfway competent pvp pilot? Did anybody here expect that situation "ever"?
aarondmorgan
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Reputation: 20

It's not really about a pilot's competency.... If you have 0 cap when a DCU goes to cycle, it won't cycle. I don't even see the issue here.

Also, +1. I can't wait to try this fit out. It looks hella fun.
aarondmorgan
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Reputation: 20

It's not really about a pilot's competency.... If you have 0 cap when a DCU goes to cycle, it won't cycle. I don't even see the issue here.

Also, +1. I can't wait to try this fit out. It looks hella fun.

Solo Arbitrator

Sentiax's Arbitrator built 2009-12-12

Sentiax
23 Loadouts
137 8
596 Views
TAGS
Spaceship
Medium Energy Neutralizer II
Small Energy Neutralizer II
Small Energy Neutralizer II
Small Energy Neutralizer II
Warp Scrambler II
Medium Capacitor Booster II
DDO Photometry Tracking Disruptor I
Experimental 10MN Afterburner I
Damage Control II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
800mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Empty
Medium Egress Port Maximizer I
Medium Egress Port Maximizer I
Medium Egress Port Maximizer I
Modulename
This is the arbitrator I fly solo. I love it very much and have had extreme success with it. You can solo most ships with it if you are a good pilot, and swapping out the scram and pairing it with a high dps cruiser or bc makes it a very gruesome combo on single ships or groups of 2 or three. I know that most people think it needs a mwd, but the afterburner is actually the key to the setup. BC's with ab's and boosters are your bane though, and rupture's can be tough if you don't get your orbit pattern right. I generally orbit right on the edge of my small neuts range, depending on ship using a tracking disruption script or optimal range. The td is very effective on all types of guns, you just have to know where to orbit and what script to use. It will generally neut most cruisers t1 or t2 within 2 or 3 cycles of the medium neut, and even gives mwd boosting bc's a hard time. The egress port maximizers make this setup rock. it is stable with the medium neut or 2 small ones, and lasts for a whole 1min 50 sec with everything on, so you only have to boost roughly every minute and a couple seconds. Once you shut off mwd or neut non boosting ships it's pretty much over. I've dropped every t1 ship class solo in this ship, and paired it with a vexor have killed command ships among other things. Also, of course, avoid missile ships and generally large drone bay ships. On Bc's like the brutix and hurricane it helps to pop their drones first. Now for stats

Speed: 465
EHP: 19,148
Cap: 1min 50 sec
dps:
Hammers: 237
Valks: 193
Hobs: 148
Warriors: 120

Targeting

Maximum targets 7
Maximum targeting range 62.5 km
Scan resolution 356.25
Sensor strength 0 0 0 15

Size/Movement

Maximum velocity 591.4
Inertia modifier 0.378
Signature radius 130 m
Cargo capacity 345 m3

Systems

Capacitor capacity 1718.75 GJ
Capacitor recharge time 6 minutes 7 seconds
Powergrid 647 / 718.75MW
CPU 295 / 406.25 tf

Shields

Shield capacity 1375
Shield recharge time 15 minutes 37 seconds
Shield resistances 12.5% 56.25% 47.5% 30%

Armor

Armor hit points 4500
Armor resistances 75.05% 60.08% 62.58% 67.57%

Structure

Structure hit points 2000
Structure resistances 60% 60% 60% 60%
Drone bandwidth 50 Mbit/sec
Drone control range 0 m

Drones

Drone capacity 150 m3
Download EVEMon Skill Plan
[Arbitrator, Solo Arbitrator]
Damage Control II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
800mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Empty

Warp Scrambler II
Medium Capacitor Booster II
DDO Photometry Tracking Disruptor I
Experimental 10MN Afterburner I

Medium Energy Neutralizer II
Small Energy Neutralizer II
Small Energy Neutralizer II
Small Energy Neutralizer II

Medium Egress Port Maximizer I
Medium Egress Port Maximizer I
Medium Egress Port Maximizer I


Hammerhead II
Hobgoblin II
Warrior II
Valkyrie II
Item Quantity Value
Arbitrator 1 9,450,000
Warp Scrambler II 1 1,233,330
Medium Capacitor Booster II 1 850,000
Damage Control II 1 467,386
Hammerhead II 1 696,995
Hobgoblin II 1 414,715
Warrior II 1 419,835
DDO Photometry Tracking Disruptor I 1 4,001
Experimental 10MN Afterburner I 1 1,750
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II 2 639,000
800mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I 1 315,008
Medium Energy Neutralizer II 1 1,605,000
Small Energy Neutralizer II 3 1,059,990
Valkyrie II 1 719,999
Optimal Range Disruption Script 1 6,899
Tracking Speed Disruption Script 1 5,598
Medium Egress Port Maximizer I 3 689,900
Total 22,718,186
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